Parliamentary search - Children and Adoption Bill [HL]

Type

Parliamentary proceeding

Reference

674 c1-68GC

Session

2005-06

Department

Department for Education and Skills
Committee of the Whole House (HL)

Legislative stage

Committee stage

Procedure

New clauses

Chamber / Committee

House of Lords Grand Committee

Children and Adoption Bill (HL). Explanatory Notes HL Bill 10-EN also published
Monday, 13 June 2005
Bills
House of Lords

Deposited Paper HDEP 2005/477
Thursday, 20 October 2005
Deposited papers
House of Lords

Proceeding contributions

Lord Northbourne | 674 c4-5GC (Link to this contribution) I am a little confused by the groupings. Amendments Nos. 1, 3, 4 and 5 seem an integral part of any ...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c8GC (Link to this contribution) I agree entirely with the noble Lord, Lord Northbourne. I thank the Minister for that detailed reply...

Show all contributions (92)

Lord Adonis | 674 c19-20GC (Link to this contribution) The points made by my noble friend Lady Pitkeathley and the noble Baroness, Lady Howarth, are absolu...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c19GC (Link to this contribution) I would be very unhappy if we shifted the injustice from one parent to another. That is not what I a...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c21GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for that. For the moment, I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment, by...

Baroness Pitkeathley | 674 c38GC (Link to this contribution) The amendments are quite complex, and I am not yet exactly sure how they would work in practice. How...

Earl of Listowel | 674 c50GC (Link to this contribution) It is so helpful to have these arguments thrashed out. The noble Baroness said that ““reasonable con...

Earl of Listowel | 674 c62-3GC (Link to this contribution) I shall speak to my amendments in this group, which are probing amendments. The courts draw very hea...

Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 674 c63-4GC (Link to this contribution) I shall speak to Amendment No. 26. The Bill reinforces the present position, but it does not take in...

Baroness Barker | 674 c61GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister very much for that reply. I will study what he has said with great care. I woul...

Baroness Walmsley | 674 c61-2GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 23: "Page 2, line 6, at end insert—" ““( ) psychological assessment or tr...

Earl Howe | 674 c65GC (Link to this contribution) I understand totally the motivation that lies behind the noble Earl’s amendments, but there is a dis...

Lord Brougham and Vaux | 674 c1GC (Link to this contribution) Before I put the Question that the Title of the Bill be postponed, may I remind your Lordships of tw...

Lord Adonis | 674 c6-8GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the noble Baroness for her opening remarks and, indeed, to all of those who helped ...

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c4GC (Link to this contribution) I absolutely agree with the sentiment behind what the noble Baroness says; what I disagree with is w...

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c11GC (Link to this contribution) I almost missed my moment, for which I apologise. I want to ask three questions. It is difficult to...

Earl Howe | 674 c8-11GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 2: "Before Clause 1, insert the following new clause—" ““REASONABLE CONTAC...

Lord Adonis | 674 c12GC (Link to this contribution) None the less, the two amendments need to be considered together. If we were to go down the road bei...

Earl Howe | 674 c11GC (Link to this contribution) That amendment is in a different group.

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c18GC (Link to this contribution) I feel that I must say something at this point. Clearly, we are all agreed that what we need is posi...

Earl of Listowel | 674 c14GC (Link to this contribution) I have listened with great interest to what the noble Earl has said. It reminded me of an observatio...

Earl Howe | 674 c14GC (Link to this contribution) I do not think that the noble Baroness need be frightened in any way of the word ““reasonable””. The...

Earl Howe | 674 c13GC (Link to this contribution) I do not wish to gainsay anything that the noble Baroness has said, and I have very high regard for ...

Lord Adonis | 674 c21GC (Link to this contribution) The Family Resolutions pilot has now drawn to a close and will not go into a second year. We are eva...

Lord Northbourne | 674 c21GC (Link to this contribution) My point is that you can use a presumption to get people to reach an agreement.

Baroness Pitkeathley | 674 c18GC (Link to this contribution) Noble Lords will not be surprised to hear that I share that unease. However, I wish to discuss parti...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c25-6GC (Link to this contribution) So eager was I to hear the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, that only when she said that she could not...

Lord Northbourne | 674 c25GC (Link to this contribution) The defect of both amendments, as I read them, is that they do not actually say what the mediation i...

Earl of Listowel | 674 c35-6GC (Link to this contribution) I would like to look at these lengthy amendments in more detail, but I strongly support them in prin...

Earl Howe | 674 c36-8GC (Link to this contribution) I offer my strong support in principle for the amendments that cover the risk assessment checklist. ...

Lord Adonis | 674 c29GC (Link to this contribution) Contempt of court, as in all such cases.

Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 674 c29-33GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 6: "Before Clause 1, insert the following new clause—" ““PRE-COURT CHECKS ...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c29GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for his detailed reply. I was pleased to hear him say that there is actually no...

Lord Adonis | 674 c50-2GC (Link to this contribution) I begin by recognising complete defeat. The noble Earl has scored a great victory in persuading the ...

Baroness Walmsley | 674 c44-7GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. *11: "Before Clause 1, insert the following new clause—" ““WELFARE OF THE ...

Lord Adonis | 674 c44GC (Link to this contribution) I am sorry but in view of the labyrinthine complexity of those amendments moved by my noble friends ...

Lord Northbourne | 674 c48-9GC (Link to this contribution) I should like to join both noble Baronesses in supporting these amendments, but to consider the poss...

Earl Howe | 674 c44GC (Link to this contribution) I am most grateful to the Minister. In the light of his earlier remarks I realised that he would be ...

Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 674 c42-3GC (Link to this contribution) I thank my noble friend for his very detailed reply. I do not intend to start a debate about the var...

Earl Howe | 674 c64GC (Link to this contribution) I should like to emphasise one word in Section 11A(6)(a); that is, ““required””. The Bill seems to s...

Baroness Crawley | 674 c65-8GC (Link to this contribution) I thank all noble Lords who took part in that short but thoughtful debate. I too shall break my sile...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c5GC (Link to this contribution) I suppose that we could have taken all the amendments in one huge grouping because one often is cont...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c6GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Baroness, Lady Howarth, is an expert in the issues. Therefore, I would not presume to say ...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c1-3GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 1: "Before Clause 1, insert the following new clause—" ““CO-PARENTING A...

Earl Howe | 674 c11GC (Link to this contribution) I am suggesting a presumption of reasonable contact. The law at the moment provides for a presumptio...

Lord Adonis | 674 c11GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I may interrupt for a moment. Does not a later amendment tabled by the noble Earl have a pre...

Lord Northbourne | 674 c8GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I may comment on what the noble Lord has just said about ““time””. It is not only time; it i...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c16-7GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 3: "Before Clause 1, insert the following new clause—" ““FREQUENT AND CONT...

Earl Howe | 674 c16GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for his reply. There is scope for us to confer outside these four walls when th...

Lord Northbourne | 674 c14GC (Link to this contribution) Might it be possible between now and the next stage of the Bill to draft a definition—a word or a se...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c21GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the Minister for his reply. I also thank all noble Lords who have taken part in the debate. ...

Lord Adonis | 674 c21GC (Link to this contribution) I understand the force of the point that the noble Lord makes, but if the parents knew that that wou...

Lord Northbourne | 674 c20GC (Link to this contribution) I was very interested by what the noble Lord said. I do not support the two amendments as they are d...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c26GC (Link to this contribution) I shall speak to Amendment No. 27. I have already discussed my detailed amendment on dispute resolut...

Earl of Listowel | 674 c26-7GC (Link to this contribution) May I say how very strongly I support the principle that the noble Baroness is putting forward? She ...

Lord Adonis | 674 c27-9GC (Link to this contribution) We heard a lot about horses and water in the opening remarks made by the noble Baroness. I assure he...

Baroness Walmsley | 674 c29GC (Link to this contribution) What would the Minister do in a situation where someone can perfectly well afford it, but will not d...

Baroness Walmsley | 674 c24-5GC (Link to this contribution) Our Amendment No. 14 in this group is similar in some ways to Amendment No. 5, moved by the noble Ba...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c22-4GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 5:"Before Clause 1, insert the following new clause—" ““PRE-COURT DISPUTE R...

Lord Adonis | 674 c38-42GC (Link to this contribution) These are very grave issues, and we intend to study with great care the weighty contributions that h...

Baroness Thornton | 674 c33-5GC (Link to this contribution) I rise to support my noble friend Lady Gould and to speak to the amendments tabled in my name in thi...

Lord Adonis | 674 c29GC (Link to this contribution) It is in the best interests of the child that the parent pays for and undergoes the courses in quest...

Baroness Barker | 674 c55-8GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 15: "Page 1, line 7, after ““which”” insert ““the safety of the child is not an...

Baroness Walmsley | 674 c53-5GC (Link to this contribution) First, I thank everyone who has taken part in this debate and the Minister for his response. I am pl...

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c47-8GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Baroness said somewhat firmly to me that I had asked the question on reasonableness. I ask...

Earl Howe | 674 c44GC (Link to this contribution) Again I am grateful. I beg leave to withdraw the amendment. Amendment, by leave, withdrawn.

Earl Howe | 674 c49GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I may make a comment in response to what the noble Baroness, Lady Howarth, said. My firm und...

Earl Howe | 674 c43-4GC (Link to this contribution) moved Amendment No. 10:" Before Clause 1, insert the following new clause—" ““Reasonable cont...

Baroness Pitkeathley | 674 c68GC (Link to this contribution) The Committee stands adjourned until 3.30 pm on Wednesday 12 October.

Earl of Listowel | 674 c64GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the noble Earl, Lord Howe, for raising that point. I recognise its fundamental importance. D...

Baroness Walmsley | 674 c68GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the noble Baroness for her explanation. In introducing the amendment I said that it was prob...

Baroness Gould of Potternewton | 674 c3-4GC (Link to this contribution) I want to ask a simple question of the noble Baroness, Lady Morris. She referred to circumstances in...

Earl of Listowel | 674 c3GC (Link to this contribution) I should like to clear up a couple of things in my mind from what the noble Baroness has just said. ...

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c5-6GC (Link to this contribution) I did not say anything about satisfaction. I am prepared to do so if the noble Baroness wishes. In a...

Lord Northbourne | 674 c6GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Baroness confirms what I was saying, that process is very important if it can be used earl...

Lord Northbourne | 674 c11GC (Link to this contribution) I do not want to bore the Committee, but the 1982 Florida statute states:"““It is the public policy ...

Earl Howe | 674 c12GC (Link to this contribution) ““No”” is the answer to that. We have deliberately kept the two amendments separate. I wanted to int...

Lord Adonis | 674 c14-6GC (Link to this contribution) I do not think that there is an issue here: case law is firmly established. However, we are anxious ...

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c12-3GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Earl will recognise that that is exactly what I sought to do. I am not a lawyer, but this ...

Baroness Pitkeathley | 674 c13-4GC (Link to this contribution) As the chair of CAFCASS, I remind the Committee of the situations in which my colleagues are attempt...

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c19GC (Link to this contribution) If we are talking about a third of the child’s time, who gets the time when the child is at school a...

Baroness Morris of Bolton | 674 c18-9GC (Link to this contribution) I say to the noble Baroness, Lady Pitkeathley, that I shall discuss how children change over time. ...

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c26GC (Link to this contribution) May I make an uncharacteristic intervention? One amendment suggests that the mediator should set the...

Baroness Walmsley | 674 c29GC (Link to this contribution) Is that in the best interests of the child?

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c53GC (Link to this contribution) No, I believe that there should be some presumption of contact. We need to ensure that the assessmen...

Earl Howe | 674 c53GC (Link to this contribution) Can I get it clear that the noble Baroness is unhappy with the state of the law as it stands, becaus...

Lord Adonis | 674 c58-61GC (Link to this contribution) I hope that I have not been guilty of unduly pointing out technical deficiencies in amendments altho...

Earl Howe | 674 c52GC (Link to this contribution) I find the Minister’s position very confusing. On the one hand, he is saying that in case law there ...

Baroness Howarth of Breckland | 674 c53GC (Link to this contribution) The real problem is in the complexity of the work. That is why I am very concerned about any change ...

Lord Adonis | 674 c52-3GC (Link to this contribution) The situation is clear. We do not believe that the position needs to be changed. The current arrange...

Lord Adonis | 674 c44GC (Link to this contribution) I shall study what the noble Earl has said with great care. As I understand it, the amendment simply...

Baroness Crawley | 674 c68GC (Link to this contribution) Perhaps I may suggest that this is an appropriate moment at which to bring our deliberations to a cl...

Subjects

Children

Adoption

Contact orders

Absent parents

Domestic abuse

Family proceedings

Protection

Parents

Parental responsibility

Legislation

Children and Adoption Bill (HL) 2005-06

Link

View this Parliamentary proceeding on www.publications.parliament.uk