Government of Wales Bill. Lords Report stage first day. (part 1 of 2)
Government of Wales Bill
Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
683 c1109-57
Session
2005-06
Legislative stage
Report stage
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords chamber
Proceeding contributions
Lord Evans of Temple Guiting | 683 c1114 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I remind noble Lords that we are on Report. We have been through Second Reading and Commit...
Lord Roberts of Llandudno | 683 c1113 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, perhaps I may interrupt the noble Lord to ask: does not Northern Ireland also have STV for...
Show all contributions (83)
Lord Trimble | 683 c1112 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the noble Lord is quite correct. There were two referenda, two attempts by the Irish Gover...
Lord Roberts of Llandudno | 683 c1110-1 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I support these amendments. I shall tell the House why I am convinced that the Government ...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1151 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, that is an additional point—the noble Lord, Lord Roberts of Conwy, is as perspicacious as ...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1152-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord for the way in which he moved the amendment, but he will r...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1151 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I, too, see a role for the Secretary of State for Wales, particularly with regard to what ...
Lord Roberts of Conwy | 683 c1150 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for having given us a synopsis of these amendments, which ar...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1154-5 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Livsey, may refer to the amendment of the noble Lord, Lord Kingsland,...
Lord Crickhowell | 683 c1156 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, Clause 37 was referred to by the noble Lord, Lord Livsey. It is very specific. Clause 37(3...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1153 (Link to this contribution)
No, my Lords, they certainly will not know it in sufficient detail to be able to determine what affe...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1137 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I did not say that what the noble Baroness had expressed was chaos. She had indicated the ...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1135-7 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, let me begin by stating that we are on common ground. We want the committees of the Assemb...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 683 c1137 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, before the noble Lord sits down, and with the leave of the House, he suggested that what I...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 683 c1134-5 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Livsey, mentioned that the Scottish Parliament has moved to a simpler...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1133 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we, too, have tabled an amendment about the committee system and are critical of the d’Hon...
Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 683 c1133-4 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I added my name to the amendment having spoken to many people in the Assembly. In Committe...
Lord Evans of Temple Guiting | 683 c1149-50 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 20:"Page 20, line 29, leave out ““day on which the””"
The noble Lord said: My L...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1147 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we have a great deal of sympathy with the amendment. It is important that the budgets are ...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1141 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as the noble Baroness has said, the situation is analogous to a public accounts committee ...
Baroness Noakes | 683 c1142-3 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank the Minister for that reply and I thank the noble Lord, Lord Livsey, for his suppo...
Baroness Noakes | 683 c1145 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendments Nos. 16:"Page 19, line 36, leave out ““Audit”” and insert ““Accounts”” .""Page 19, ...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1120 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the surprising thing about this amendment is that it would amend a Bill, when such provisi...
Lord Roberts of Conwy | 683 c1120 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, tempting though it is to embrace the principle of the open list, as my party has done in t...
Lord Roberts of Llandudno | 683 c1123 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 6:"Page 5, line 19, at end insert—"
““(8) In the event of a candidate’s death,...
Lord Roberts of Llandudno | 683 c1124 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank the Minister for his assurance. Having heard what he said, I beg leave to withdraw...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1123-4 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I hear what the noble Lord says, and that helps to a degree. The real reason why I am goin...
Lord Anderson of Swansea | 683 c1125 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I recall the debates at the time of the reduction of the voting age from 21 to 18. There w...
Earl of Mar and Kellie | 683 c1126 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, if the age were reduced to 16, it would mean that, depending on when they were born, some ...
Lord Roberts of Llandudno | 683 c1126-7 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank the Minister for his response and I thank noble Lords for expressing their views i...
Lord Henley | 683 c1127-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as the noble Lord, Lord Livsey, has made clear, we have tabled a similar amendment, Amendm...
Lord Anderson of Swansea | 683 c1114-5 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, given the final remarks of the noble Lord and his useful experience of Ireland, perhaps I ...
Lord Elystan-Morgan | 683 c1115-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, with great humility and respect, I suggest that we may be discussing the wrong question. T...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1119-20 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 5:"Page 4, line 36, at end insert—"
““( ) The regional returning officer s...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1118-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am surprised at the length of the debate and the interest shown in it. It demonstrates t...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1118 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, it is not my task to advocate AMS. I am merely indicating the weaknesses of the amendment....
Lord Trimble | 683 c1113 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, indeed we do. We have it at that level—I forgot about that in my summary of the matter. We...
Lord Shutt of Greetland | 683 c1114 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, that has been abolished.
Lord Thomas of Gresford | 683 c1112 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, perhaps I may ask the noble Lord a question about the Republic of Ireland. He says that th...
Lord Trimble | 683 c1111-2 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the core of these amendments refers to the single transferable vote system, proportional r...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1109-10 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 1:"Page 1, line 8, leave out subsection (2) and insert—"
““( ) The Assembl...
Lord Rowlands | 683 c1111 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I draw the attention of the noble Lord, Lord Livsey, to the fact that the Richard commissi...
Lord Roberts of Conwy | 683 c1151 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, am I right in thinking that, even after Part 4 comes to fruition, the Secretary of State w...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1150-1 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 21:"Page 21, line 12, at end insert—"
““( ) This section ceases to have ef...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1151 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, when the Bill becomes an Act, it will increase the potential primary legislative powers of...
Lord Roberts of Conwy | 683 c1153 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, can the Minister confirm that only the Secretary of State would be in a position to know t...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1151-2 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 22:"Page 21, line 17, leave out ““Secretary of State”” and insert ““Assembly””"
...
Lord Roberts of Llandudno | 683 c1150 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we on these Benches also accept these technical amendments. We are grateful to the team wh...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1154 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, this is a very interesting amendment. Sometimes it is a good idea to extrapolate certain c...
Lord Crickhowell | 683 c1155 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, before the noble Lord sits down, will he answer the rather interesting question put by the...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1155-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, their responsibilities are referred to in Clause 37. They are Welsh Ministers and are subj...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1156 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we are distinguishing between a Welsh Minister who is responsible to the Executive and Min...
Lord Kingsland | 683 c1156-7 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, there is uncertainty about the matter. I emphasise again that this is a probing amendment;...
Lord Kingsland | 683 c1153-4 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 25:"Page 23, line 28, at end insert—"
““( ) Subsection (3) does not apply ...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1153 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I have listened with interest to this debate and to what the Minister has said. We assume ...
Lord Henley | 683 c1137-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I have to say to the noble Lord that that was a nice try, but it simply will not wash. The...
Lord Elystan-Morgan | 683 c1134 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I have a great deal of sympathy with the amendments. In this context, the House should aim...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1128-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank noble Lords who have spoken. I thank the noble Lord, Lord Henley, for his support....
Lord Henley | 683 c1131-3 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 13:"Page 18, line 24, leave out subsections (2) to (9) and insert—"
““( ) ...
Baroness Noakes | 683 c1145-7 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 19:"Page 20, line 4, at end insert—"
““(1A) The standing orders must include p...
Lord Evans of Temple Guiting | 683 c1147-9 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we appreciate the aim of the noble Baroness in tabling Amendments Nos. 19 and 74 to ensure...
Baroness Noakes | 683 c1149 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I thank the Minister for that very detailed reply, and I thank the noble Lord, Lord Livsey...
Lord Evans of Temple Guiting | 683 c1141-2 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as I outlined in Committee, we firmly believe that this is a matter for the Assembly. Inde...
Baroness Noakes | 683 c1140-1 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 15:"Page 19, line 34, leave out ““Audit Committee or Pwyllgor Archwilio”” and in...
Lord Roberts of Llandudno | 683 c1123 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, we have altered the amendment, and the Marshalled List should read ““28 days”” and not ““2...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1123 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, there was widespread concern at the last general election, when there was a delay to the r...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1121 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I note what the noble Lord, Lord Roberts of Conwy, and the Minister said. However, we are ...
Lord Roberts of Conwy | 683 c1125 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Roberts of Llandudno, is quite right that this issue has been much di...
Lord Roberts of Llandudno | 683 c1124-5 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 9:"Page 8, line 26, at end insert—"
““( ) For the purposes of subsection (...
Lord Norton of Louth | 683 c1125-6 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I reinforce the argument put forward by my noble friend on the Front Bench. There are thre...
Lord Evans of Temple Guiting | 683 c1126 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I can only repeat the Government’s position, which we made absolutely clear in Grand Commi...
Lord Dearing | 683 c1126 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I follow the argument of the noble Lord, Lord Norton. Fifty years ago, I wrote my first le...
Lord Livsey of Talgarth | 683 c1127 (Link to this contribution)
moved Amendment No. 11:"Page 17, line 27, at end insert ““not belonging to the same political group”...
Baroness Finlay of Llandaff | 683 c1128 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I put my name to Amendment No. 12, but the decision about which to support was difficult a...
Lord Evans of Temple Guiting | 683 c1128 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, as we have heard, Amendments Nos. 11 and 12 insert a requirement that the standing orders ...
Baroness Carnegy of Lour | 683 c1115 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the fact that the coalition in the Scots Parliament has opted to have STV for local govern...
Lord Roberts of Conwy | 683 c1116-7 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I shall be the soul of brevity, if not of wit. As the noble Lord, Lord Rowlands, has said,...
Lord Trimble | 683 c1114 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I appreciate the criticism, and I shall try to conclude my comments. I ask the House to fo...
Lord Thomas of Gresford | 683 c1118 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, the noble Lord is not defending the AMS system, is he? Is he aware that its biggest critic...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1117-8 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I am sorry that I was a little hesitant in rising, but I thought that other noble Lords st...
Lord Davies of Oldham | 683 c1157 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I understand the points that the noble Lord is making. I do not think that it is possible ...
Lord Kingsland | 683 c1157 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, there is the more general point that arises under Clause 84, to which I referred in my ope...
Lord Evans of Temple Guiting | 683 c1157 (Link to this contribution)
My Lords, I beg to move that further consideration on Report be now adjourned. In moving this Motion...
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2023-12-11 09:38:30 +0000
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