Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Bill

I am moving new clause 15 to introduce humanist marriage, along with new schedule 1 and amendment...

Order. I will not say that I was heckled by the Clerk of the House from a sedentary position, as ...

Thank you for that exceptionally helpful advice, Mr Speaker. I am, of course, moving new clause 1...

Will the hon. Lady give way?

I would like to make a little more progress and then take some interventions. Let us start by est...

Will the hon. Lady give way?

Of course I will.

What about me?

Does the hon. Lady not recognise that the principle in England and Wales is that the premises are...

The hon. Lady is right to highlight the general importance of the premises in English law in rela...

rose—

I will give way to the hon. Gentleman, because I promised that I would.

I know my place.

When I first received communications from humanists supporting this approa...

What the hon. Gentleman says about other religions may be correct, but it is not the case that al...

rose—

I will of course give way to the Attorney-General.

I hope the hon. Lady will accept that I make my comments in a completely neutral way and that I a...

First, although of course I respect the Attorney-General’s expert advice, I must point out that t...

rose—

I will give way in a moment, but I have not quite finished dealing with the points raised by the ...

rose—

I must say, with respect to Government Members, that I need to respond to the first point before ...

rose—

I will give way to the hon. Gentleman, who, I believe, first proposed this measure as an amendmen...

Mine will be a triangular intervention, inviting the Attorney-General to intervene on the hon. La...

My hon. Friend—if I may call him that in this context—has raised an excellent point. I hear mutte...

I do my best to provide advice on the law of England and Wales—Scottish law is unquestionably dif...

I make no great claims for my understanding of Scots law, despite having a rather elderly and unu...

rose—

I really cannot take an intervention before I have dealt with the preceding one. I will give way ...

rose—

I should love to hear from the Secretary of State.

I would not normally intervene on the hon. Lady, but she said that Government officials had advis...

I do not accept that. I do not wish for one second to impugn the messages received from officials...

The hon. Lady is making an extremely strong and compelling case, and I look forward to expressing...

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for that helpful intervention.

I was at a wedding on Sunday. I only attended the evening part, but during the day there was a hu...

I, too, have attended humanist weddings in Scotland, including that of my niece last October, whi...

The hon. Lady is making a powerful case. There are 2,500 humanist weddings in Scotland a year now...

Obviously, I do not answer for the Government, and I will not respond to any specific interventio...

rose—

I will take one more intervention, and then I am going to develop the compelling case for why we ...

The last thing that I want to do is interrupt the hon. Lady’s flow, but I want to reply very brie...

It may be challengeable under the convention, but I do not think we know at all whether such a ch...

For my own information really, can the hon. Lady say how much consultation she has had with the C...

I think that it is fair to say that the Churches are not displaying tremendous enthusiasm for thi...

I should declare an interest: I am a member of the BHA. Is the hon. Lady aware that civil registr...

I am disappointed in that question. Secular and humanist are not the same. I am not a humanist. I...

The hon. Lady will be well aware of my opinions and views on this matter. In Committee evidence, ...

With the greatest respect, I do not think the hon. Gentleman has any evidence whatever that milli...

Will the hon. Lady give way?

No, not until I have dealt with the question fully. I do not believe the hon. Gentleman has evide...

Will the hon. Lady give way?

I will give way to the hon. Gentleman; he is next.

Many people of faith—I think this is the...

I am grateful to the hon. Lady for giving way, and I must point out that my hon. Friend the Membe...

I am grateful for that welcome and helpful intervention and for the intervention from the hon. Me...

I have one fairly fundamental disagreement with the British Humanist Association, which is that I...

I am grateful to my hon. Friend for that intervention. The Secretary of State has been extremely ...

Will the hon. Lady give way?

I will not, as I am just coming to a conclusion.

If during this afternoon’s debate the Gove...

Let me start by saying that I have great admiration for humanists. My mother was a Quaker and I w...

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Of course I will give way to the hon. Lady, but may I finish the point?

Those locks are bas...

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

I am going to give way to the hon. Lady, but let me finish the point because it is important.

I do not see why faith groups should be singled out for consultation. If there is to be consultat...

My point is that no one has been consulted. I was not praying in aid just faith groups. The hon. ...

I think that the hon. Gentleman has now accepted that he was not correct to say that all marriage...

My hon. Friend is wrong. I have made it quite clear throughout that English marriage law is build...

The new clause would not allow pagan marriage to take place. It would allow humanist marriage to ...

The hon. Lady is a lawyer so, with the greatest respect, she has no excuse for not listening to t...

I strongly object to what the hon. Gentleman is suggesting—that we in Scotland could not care les...

Nothing that I have said could possibly be construed as implying that Scotland is not concerned a...

The new clause as drafted, which has been exhaustively considered by the advisers of the British ...

The House will know, because it is a matter of record, that I am a freemason. Freemasons are regi...

I think the hon. Gentleman united the House in confirming that he is confused. We all agree with ...

First, the only point that I am confused about is whether this is a wrecking amendment. Secondly,...

Notwithstanding the Bishop of Chester, does my hon. Friend agree that some very clear problems ar...

I want to conclude by making a further and serious point.

Those of us who were opponents of...

rose—

No, I am about to finish. [Interruption.] I have given way to the hon. Gentleman on a number of o...

I welcome the debate. I strongly support new clause 15 and the associated amendments, and believe...

I have been searching for information but cannot find it on how many humanist weddings there are ...

Six hundred.

Two thousand five hundred a year.

Hon. Members are calling out numbers to me—600 in England and 2,500 in Scotland. Why something is...

In the 2011 census, 25% professed no religion. That is more than 14 million people. Does the hon....

I thank the hon. Gentleman for those figures, which had escaped me for the moment. Indeed, 25% is...

I do not think there is any question about the desirability of humanist marriages. The issue is t...

I thank the hon. Lady for her intervention, but I suspect that similar arguments were displayed w...

To reinforce the point made in the earlier intervention, there is a great deal of sympathy for th...

At some time, somebody can explain to me the difficulties. I just do not accept those difficultie...

A couple of hon. Members have said that the new clause would unpick the locks, but they have so f...

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his intervention. Those Members sitting on the Government side of ...

I want to intervene while the Attorney-General is in the Chamber. Was the hon. Gentleman, like me...

It is bizarre, but I must say that I am not a lawyer—I am only a humble economist—so these things...

I will say this one last time. It has nothing to do with the merits or otherwise of wanting to ex...

I thank the Attorney-General for that intervention. No doubt Scotland will be drummed out of the ...

Order. There are too many private conversations going on and I am struggling to hear—[Interruptio...

In conclusion, I want to put it on the record that I strongly support new clause 15 and very much...

I want first to speak to new clause 15 and to express my full support for it. After doing so, I w...

I commend my hon. Friend for tabling new clause 14 and for advancing the argument that I hope to ...

I thank my right hon. Friend for that pertinent contribution. I support his new clause 18 and the...

Would the new clause, in essence, abolish marriage and civil partnerships and replace it with civ...

Technically, in terms of the law, absolutely. As I said yesterday, the new clause cannot be seen ...

Would my hon. Friend’s proposals mean that Methodists, Catholics and others who fought for many y...

I believe that Methodists and Catholics should have exactly the same rights as humanists, Baptist...

I welcome the debate on this subject; we had a shorter debate in the Bill Committee. The hon. Gen...

My hon. Friend is touching on the elephant in the room, which is the establishment of the Church ...

It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Leeds North West (Greg Mulholland) and his interes...

I did not say that. Those of us who oppose the Bill have tried hard, so far as is possible, to ma...

I accept that the assurances that have been offered to faith groups should be delivered and guara...

I am much taken with the idea of having some form of humanist marriage, but I am worried that by ...

Clearly, we are here to debate the Bill. The people who push for delays and referendums tend to b...

Does my hon. Friend agree that although the concerns that are being raised about process may be q...

I very much agree with that important point. We are all aware of the political difficulties in th...

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

I did not know that the hon. Gentleman was a tiddlywinks fanatic.

I am not a tiddlywinks expert, but I am a humanist. I am a member of the British Humanist Associa...

I am grateful for that intervention. It elaborates the point that we should not spend too much ti...

After a reasonably intelligent start, it is disappointing that the hon. Gentleman is making silly...

I am sorry that the hon. Gentleman is slightly lacking in a sense of humour. My point about wakin...

I agree with the hon. Gentleman’s sentiment that we need to make progress, but speaking as a supp...

It is important that we have this debate. My view comes from looking at the detail of the Bill an...

I fundamentally disagree with the hon. Gentleman’s point. He made fun of the advice given to us b...

The status quo is discriminatory in any case, which is why we are asking for equality for same-se...

I rise to reassure the hon. Member for Luton North (Kelvin Hopkins) that there is support for him...

Again, I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for taking an intervention. I am not making this up; I...

If the Attorney-General’s advice is correct, there is a slight problem because existing laws are ...

rose—

I am just about to conclude, but I cannot resist taking an intervention.

That is characteristically generous of my hon. Friend. He said that there were no principled obje...

My hon. Friend speaks for the Church of England in this House and his principled objection is tha...

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman, but may I help him with the tiddlywinks issue? The Attorney-...

I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman. I cannot see anything wrong with the point he has just made,...

The hon. Gentleman is making a powerful speech and is generous in giving way. There is an issue o...

To be fair to the Attorney-General, that is precisely what he said. He thought it would be perfec...

Earlier in my political life I was Minister of Finance and Personnel in the Northern Ireland Exec...

As ever, the hon. Gentleman brings an interesting perspective from his experience. Regardless of ...

I absolutely share the hon. Gentleman’s concern. That will be one of the difficulties. The fewer ...

I am happy to follow the hon. Member for Foyle (Mark Durkan). I agree with a huge number of his c...

I originally proposed a version of new clause 10 in Committee. I did not see it as an attempt to ...

Order. We are obviously not going to reopen yesterday’s debate. We are discussing other amendment...

The proposals appear to be linked, Mr Deputy Speaker. I thank my hon. Friend for that proposal an...

Will the right hon. Gentleman give way?

I will give way, but I anticipate being able to deal with the hon. Lady’s intervention.

On the question of children, is the right hon. Gentleman arguing that couples who are infertile o...

Order. We are not talking about infertile couples. Unfortunately, we are on the humanist part of ...

I will not, but with respect I want to say a word about humanism and speak to my new clause 18, w...

I respect my right hon. Friend on many things, but I disagree with quite a lot of what he is sayi...

If my hon. Friend will bear with me, I do not believe that and I am not arguing that. They should...

Will the right hon. Gentleman tell me what his proposal would mean to a Nigerian couple on Old Ke...

That is a good question. The hon. Lady, as a former Southwark councillor, knows well the communit...

I apologise, Mr Deputy Speaker, for having to leave the Chamber earlier.

On Second Reading,...

My hon. Friend is making an interesting speech, and I think we can all identify with what he says...

rose—

Order. The hon. Members for Inverclyde (Mr McKenzie) and for Ayr, Carrick and Cumnock (Sandra Osb...

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I will take your direction and end by simply saying that respect...

Like my hon. Friend the Member for Reigate (Mr Blunt), I wish to speak in favour of new clause 15...

My hon. Friend is making an excellent speech in favour of humanist weddings. I agree with him in ...

Of course I have total respect for the Attorney-General’s opinions, but as we all know, in law an...

Is the hon. Gentleman suggesting that we should ignore the advice and legal opinion offered by th...

People ignore legal advice for all sorts of reasons. I am saying that I would like that legal opi...

It is a great pleasure to follow the excellent speech by my hon. Friend the Member for Hove (Mike...

The hon. Gentleman is presuming; the fact those people who are currently in the Chamber do not ex...

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his comment. He is absolutely right to suggest that we cannot spec...

The hon. Gentleman is making some strong points. Anecdotally, in my constituency, a former member...

I thank the hon. Gentleman for making that point. I should declare that I am a member of the Brit...

I am sorry, but I must complete what the letter sent by the Under-Secretary of State for Justice,...

I thank the right hon. Lady for reading out the rest of the letter, and I am happy for anybody to...

I echo my hon. Friend the Member for Cambridge (Dr Huppert) in paying tribute to the shadow Minis...

The force is not with them.

Indeed; the force is not with those arguments!

The other argument that has been put forward...

There was more legislation before that as well, not least the Book of Common Prayer, which lays d...

I suppose I did tempt the hon. Gentleman to intervene, although I did also say “since the Reforma...

We have had a robust and impassioned debate on a subject about which people feel very strongly. I...

There are many points on which I would love to tackle the Secretary of State, including the idea ...

My hon. Friend reads my mind, because I was about to go on to that very point. He is right: it is...

I do not follow the right hon. Lady’s logic. She says that the Jews and the Quakers have a partic...

Because the existing arrangement pre-dates the European convention on human rights, as the hon. G...

Will my right hon. Friend give way?

May I make a tiny bit of progress before taking my hon. Friend’s intervention?

Furthermore,...

May we ask that that letter sets out in detail the Government’s objections in the context of the ...

I am happy to say that the letter would be a comprehensive statement of the concerns that I have....

My right hon. Friend has advanced the rather preposterous proposition that the United Kingdom’s a...

My hon. Friend may not have fully understood the argument being put forward by the Attorney-Gener...

Will my right hon. Friend give way?

Will my hon. Friend allow me to respond to his intervention before he intervenes on me again?

I do not think that the Secretary of State quite addressed the question put by the hon. Member fo...

Mr. Huppert, it is not necessary to restate at length a previous question. I remind you that inte...

I can be very clear. It is not coalition policy to undertake the actions that the hon. Gentleman ...

I thank the Secretary of State for that kind acknowledgment. The new clause was very much an atte...

I do not believe that we are changing marriage. Marriage is one state, which we are enabling a ne...

Will my right hon. Friend give way, briefly?

I will make some progress, because we have another string of amendments to get through.

The...

Does the Minister not accept, however, that there are many people who believe that the civil stat...

I entirely agree with what my right hon. Friend says and think that is what the Bill delivers. It...

I thank all right hon. and hon. Members who have contributed to this interesting and, at times, p...

Let me make it quite that it has to be a belief organisation because unless there are some ground...

I appreciate the Attorney-General’s concern that there could be human rights challenges on those ...

I beg to move amendment 15, page 10, line 24, at end add—

‘(9) Where a civil partnership fo...

With this it will be convenient to discuss the following:

Government amendments 25 to 39.