UK Parliament / Open data

Repeal of the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011

Backbench debate on Thursday, 23 October 2014, in the House of Commons, led by Edward Leigh. The answering member was Sam Gyimah.
Tenth backbench debate (part one). Motion that this House believes that the Government should bring forward proposals to repeal the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011. Negatived on division (21 to 68).
Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
586 
Session
2014-15
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Proceeding contributions
Edward Leigh | 586 c1069 (Link to this contribution)

I beg to move,

That this House believes that the Government should bring forward proposals ...

William Cash | 586 c1070 (Link to this contribution)

On my hon. Friend’s remarks about the coalition, I have read his piece on the ConservativeHome we...


Show all contributions (145)
Edward Leigh | 586 cc1070-1 (Link to this contribution)

It is not for me to speak for the Liberal Democrats—unfortunately they seem to be absent from the...

Graham Allen | 586 c1071 (Link to this contribution)

Is the logical extension of the hon. Gentleman’s argument that President Obama should be given th...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1071 (Link to this contribution)

The whole point is that the American system is completely different from ours, so it would be unw...

Barry Sheerman | 586 c1071 (Link to this contribution)

I agree with much of what the hon. Gentleman is saying, but I think his comment about the former ...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1071 (Link to this contribution)

I take back that cheap shot against Tony Blair—it was perhaps unnecessary—and I entirely agree wi...

Robert Syms | 586 c1071 (Link to this contribution)

When President Nixon and Spiro Agnew resigned, the United States ended up with a President and Vi...

Edward Leigh | 586 cc1071-2 (Link to this contribution)

Exactly; that is a very fair point.

Our own beloved Mark Darcy, a BBC journalist who is rea...

Lord Dodds of Duncairn | 586 c1072 (Link to this contribution)

I am following the hon. Gentleman’s argument carefully. Does he agree that, for the purposes of c...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1072 (Link to this contribution)

In my personal view, that is a fair point. The right hon. Gentleman has intervened at a good poin...

Greg Knight | 586 c1072 (Link to this contribution)

Is my hon. Friend saying not only that he is against fixed-term Parliaments but that the flexibil...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1072 (Link to this contribution)

No, I am not saying that. I think we should simply go back to the old system and the Prime Minist...

Edward Leigh | 586 cc1072-3 (Link to this contribution)

Sorry, three years and 10 months. So if we stick with this Act, in the next century we could lose...

Peter Bone | 586 c1073 (Link to this contribution)

That points exactly to the other argument on this issue. Had the former Prime Minister gone to th...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1073 (Link to this contribution)

That is the other side of the coin, which is why the Liberal party, which always delights in its ...

Kevin Brennan | 586 c1073 (Link to this contribution)

Is it not entirely unfair to criticise the Liberal Democrats when they are not here to defend the...

Edward Leigh | 586 cc1073-4 (Link to this contribution)

That is a good point. [Interruption.] Why be fair in politics anyway—they are not.

This con...

Andrew Turner | 586 c1074 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is doing jolly well and I love the things that he is saying, but before he moves o...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1074 (Link to this contribution)

This was the subject of a very good debate among experts in the Hansard Society. They pointed out...

Greg Knight | 586 c1074 (Link to this contribution)

I think my hon. Friend is factually incorrect when he says that we will not have a Government. We...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1074 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, that is true, but we all know—my right hon. Friend has been a Minister as have I—that the mo...

William Cash | 586 c1074 (Link to this contribution)

Will my hon. Friend be good enough to give way?

William Cash | 586 c1074 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, indeed. With respect to the role of the civil service—of Lord Gus O’Donnell specifically—in ...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1075 (Link to this contribution)

I did not know about that, but my hon. Friend raises a good point, and I am very worried about it...

Graham Allen | 586 c1075 (Link to this contribution)

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I am sorry to interrupt the hon. Gentleman, but the an...

Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 586 c1075 (Link to this contribution)

I appreciate the eloquence and humour with which the hon. Gentleman has made his point, but it is...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1075 (Link to this contribution)

I am coming to an end. I have put it several times to our beloved Prime Minister that we should e...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1076 (Link to this contribution)

I was about to end, but I will give way one last time.

Christopher Chope | 586 c1076 (Link to this contribution)

Will my hon. Friend pray in aid the example of Ukraine, which has parliamentary elections this we...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1076 (Link to this contribution)

Indeed, and dangerous situations can often be the result of fixed-terms.

We could see, as a...

Graham Allen | 586 cc1076-7 (Link to this contribution)

I am delighted that we can now come on to the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011 debate, and I am pl...

Mark Field | 586 c1077 (Link to this contribution)

I share some of the hon. Gentleman’s concern at the lamentable way in which Parliament fails to h...

Graham Allen | 586 c1077 (Link to this contribution)

Sadly, one cannot always bring about democratic change through a rational process; it is often a ...

Graham Allen | 586 c1077 (Link to this contribution)

I will give way first to my distinguished colleague from the Political and Constitutional Reform ...

Christopher Chope | 586 c1077 (Link to this contribution)

Does the hon. Gentleman accept that the argument is essentially between those who believe in rigi...

Graham Allen | 586 c1077 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman is known for being a rather floppy and flexible individual, and perhaps I am r...

Peter Bone | 586 c1078 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman is making a powerful speech, as usual. He is right to say that this is a restr...

Graham Allen | 586 c1078 (Link to this contribution)

I am not saying that it is the fixed term that has helped create a lively Parliament; it is Membe...

John Hemming | 586 c1078 (Link to this contribution)

I share the hon. Gentleman’s concern about the power of the Executive. Does he agree that the con...

Graham Allen | 586 c1079 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman, who speaks from the Liberal Democrat Benches, would have been terribly blackg...

Kevin Brennan | 586 c1079 (Link to this contribution)

I caution against being too obsessed with the American system, because it is held in very low reg...

Graham Allen | 586 cc1079-1080 (Link to this contribution)

We should of course be very careful about taking the American example lock, stock and barrel, alt...

Graham Allen | 586 c1080 (Link to this contribution)

I give way to my very distinguished Select Committee colleague.

Andrew Turner | 586 c1080 (Link to this contribution)

I wonder whether the hon. Gentleman could assist me by explaining what would happen if, for insta...

Graham Allen | 586 c1080 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman has made a powerful case. In fact, he has unwittingly made a powerful case for...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1080 (Link to this contribution)

May I repeat the point made by the hon. Member for Cardiff West (Kevin Brennan)? We are not going...

Graham Allen | 586 cc1080-1 (Link to this contribution)

I believe that—particularly if there is a little less game-playing and a little more consensus-bu...

Mark Field | 586 c1081 (Link to this contribution)

I do not entirely disagree with the hon. Gentleman’s remarks about uncertainty in regard to elect...

Graham Allen | 586 c1081 (Link to this contribution)

The benefit of our having a final year and knowing it is a final year is that we can plan for how...

William Cash | 586 c1081 (Link to this contribution)

Did the hon. Gentleman’s Committee take evidence from Lord Norton of Louth? If so, can he remembe...

Graham Allen | 586 cc1081-3 (Link to this contribution)

I am afraid that I cannot remember, but Lord Norton of Louth—who is a very distinguished Member o...

Richard Drax | 586 c1083 (Link to this contribution)

First, there was no pre-legislative scrutiny, as far as I know, of the Fixed-term Parliaments Bil...

Graham Allen | 586 c1083 (Link to this contribution)

It is hard to pick the substance out of that intervention, but I will do my best. This is the fir...

Austin Mitchell | 586 c1083 (Link to this contribution)

I agree with everything my hon. Friend says about the benefits of Select Committees, pre-legislat...

Graham Allen | 586 cc1084-6 (Link to this contribution)

We do not contrive a system for each result—we have to do it on the basis of principle. The princ...

Robert Syms | 586 cc1086-7 (Link to this contribution)

This is an important debate and I welcome the fact that my hon. Friend the Member for Gainsboroug...

John Hemming | 586 c1087 (Link to this contribution)

Obviously, we have had fixed-term Parliaments for a long time; it is just that the Prime Minister...

Robert Syms | 586 c1087 (Link to this contribution)

Actually, the power to call a general election is a poisoned chalice for a Prime Minister: if the...

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1087 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman is making a thoughtful speech. He has spoken of the poisoned chalice, but what...

Robert Syms | 586 c1087 (Link to this contribution)

I am perfectly sure that, in normal politics, some incumbents have a slight advantage. Clearly, b...

John Hemming | 586 c1087 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for his previous answer. He said the effective test of whether the Prime M...

Robert Syms | 586 cc1087-8 (Link to this contribution)

There is an element of truth in that, but to go back to my earlier point, if a Prime Minister dis...

Robert Syms | 586 c1088 (Link to this contribution)

I will give way for the last time.

John Hemming | 586 c1088 (Link to this contribution)

I am sure that my hon. Friend agrees that a key priority of this Parliament has been to sort out ...

Robert Syms | 586 cc1088-9 (Link to this contribution)

One thing on which I disagree with my hon. Friend the Member for Gainsborough, who introduced the...

Austin Mitchell | 586 cc1089-1090 (Link to this contribution)

I support the proposal to repeal the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011. I congratulate the hon. Mem...

John Hemming | 586 c1090 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman is making the case for shorter Parliaments. The question is who should make th...

Austin Mitchell | 586 c1090 (Link to this contribution)

There could be a combination of the two. That happens in Australia and New Zealand. In New Zealan...

John Hemming | 586 c1090 (Link to this contribution)

Why does the hon. Gentleman believe that the Prime Minister alone should be able to make that dec...

Austin Mitchell | 586 c1091 (Link to this contribution)

In saying the Prime Minister, I meant the Government. It has to be a collective decision. It will...

John Hemming | 586 c1091 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the hon. Gentleman for the confirmation that it would be a party decision taken in the pa...

Austin Mitchell | 586 c1091 (Link to this contribution)

I think that that would be difficult to arrange. It is a political decision that is taken by the ...

Graham Allen | 586 c1091 (Link to this contribution)

Will my hon. Friend just beware and look across the Atlantic, where there are two-year terms? The...

Austin Mitchell | 586 cc1091-2 (Link to this contribution)

I am arguing not for a two-year term, but for a three-year term. In any case, there is a big diff...

William Cash | 586 cc1092-3 (Link to this contribution)

I opposed the Fixed-term Parliaments Bill before it was enacted at every conceivable point during...

Andrew Turner | 586 c1093 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend says he is concerned about what the Liberals are doing in standing in the way of t...

William Cash | 586 cc1093-5 (Link to this contribution)

That is an important point, and I endorse very much what my hon. Friend has said.

The arran...

Anne Main | 586 c1094 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend agree that by having a maximum length—which is not the norm, as most Parliame...

William Cash | 586 c1094 (Link to this contribution)

As ever, my hon. Friend makes huge sense. These are simple questions. It is not an abstract, theo...

Graham Allen | 586 c1096 (Link to this contribution)

Does the hon. Gentleman realise that he is making a strong argument for the direct election of th...

William Cash | 586 c1096 (Link to this contribution)

I do not accept that proposition, but we do not have time to go through all the implications. I a...

Anne Main | 586 c1096 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend agree that the public made no mention of their desire for a fixed-term Parlia...

William Cash | 586 cc1096-7 (Link to this contribution)

That is true. There was no consultation or any attempt to discuss the implications for the voters...

Bernard Jenkin | 586 cc1097-8 (Link to this contribution)

I realise I am craving the indulgence of the House. I would not normally seek to intervene in a d...

Robert Syms | 586 c1098 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is making a powerful point. Equal votes in constituencies for fair representation ...

Bernard Jenkin | 586 cc1098-9 (Link to this contribution)

I totally agree. The whole question of House of Lords reform was also being advanced for party po...

Graham Allen | 586 c1099 (Link to this contribution)

I hate to intrude on the private grief between the coalition partners, which this debate has beco...

Bernard Jenkin | 586 cc1099-1100 (Link to this contribution)

I am a little mystified by that intervention. If we are to make changes to our constitution, we n...

Lord Stunell | 586 c1100 (Link to this contribution)

During the passage of the Act, did my hon. Friend speak or vote against the measure he now so rou...

Bernard Jenkin | 586 c1100 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, I did. On Second Reading, those of us in the other Lobby were staggered at how few we were—t...

Richard Drax | 586 cc1100-1 (Link to this contribution)

It is a pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member for Harwich and North Essex (Mr Jenkin): his...

Lord Stunell | 586 c1101 (Link to this contribution)

Will my hon. Friend explain how the scenario he outlines would be improved by the possibility of ...

Richard Drax | 586 c1101 (Link to this contribution)

I refer to the quote of Lord Waddington, mentioned by my hon. Friend the Member for Stone (Sir Wi...

Lord Stunell | 586 c1102 (Link to this contribution)

I am trying to understand the logic of the argument, in which the electorate decides that no part...

Richard Drax | 586 cc1102-3 (Link to this contribution)

That is not the argument I am putting forward. There would be a period of a year or 18 months of ...

Lord Stunell | 586 c1103 (Link to this contribution)

I appreciate my hon. Friend’s generosity in giving way, but I am afraid that the logic of his arg...

Richard Drax | 586 c1103 (Link to this contribution)

As my hon. Friend the Member for Harwich and North Essex so wisely said, perish the thought that ...

William Cash | 586 c1103 (Link to this contribution)

With respect to the question of whether people outside know what we are doing, does he believe, a...

Lindsay Hoyle | 586 c1103 (Link to this contribution)

Order. There have to be short interventions. Sir William, you have already had a speech. We do no...

Richard Drax | 586 c1104 (Link to this contribution)

I always enjoy interventions from my hon. Friend the Member for Stone. I could not agree with him...

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1104 (Link to this contribution)

I congratulate the hon. Member for Gainsborough (Sir Edward Leigh) and the other Members on both ...

William Cash | 586 c1104 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman has just referred to the repeal of the prerogative. Does he believe that if th...

Stephen Twigg | 586 cc1104-5 (Link to this contribution)

I will return to that issue, which relates directly to a point that the hon. Gentleman made. He r...

Bernard Jenkin | 586 c1105 (Link to this contribution)

The problem the hon. Gentleman has is that I was told by a member of his party’s Front-Bench team...

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1105 (Link to this contribution)

The fact is that we fought an election in 2010 on a manifesto commitment to move to a fixed-term ...

Lord Stunell | 586 c1105 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman also acknowledge that the commitment was in the Liberal Democrat manifest...

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1105 (Link to this contribution)

Absolutely. I wonder whether the motion should have been worded, “That this House supports the re...

William Cash | 586 c1105 (Link to this contribution)

It is the pressure exerted at the point we reach a confidence motion that demonstrates what is go...

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1105 (Link to this contribution)

As the hon. Gentleman said in his speech, the Act retains the ability of the House to pass motion...

Bernard Jenkin | 586 c1106 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman is making a case for transferring the prerogative power to this House. What is...

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1106 (Link to this contribution)

I do not accept that. However, if the motion were to say that we should review that aspect of the...

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1106 (Link to this contribution)

I will give way one more time but then I need to be able to make my argument.

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 586 c1106 (Link to this contribution)

I am very grateful. If the hon. Gentleman accepts that the two thirds majority could be reviewed,...

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1106 (Link to this contribution)

I simply do not accept that, because there is still the provision within the Act for confidence m...

Bernard Jenkin | 586 c1106 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Stephen Twigg | 586 cc1106-7 (Link to this contribution)

No, I am not going to give way again.

The previous position gave the Prime Minister and the...

Bernard Jenkin | 586 c1107 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1107 (Link to this contribution)

No, as I have given way to the hon. Gentleman already.

More often in this place, we can wor...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1107 (Link to this contribution)

So if Labour gets an overall majority, it will not repeal the Act and it will stay in for the ful...

Stephen Twigg | 586 c1108 (Link to this contribution)

Absolutely. We supported fixed-term Parliaments in our manifesto in 2010, and our policy remains ...

Sam Gyimah | 586 c1108 (Link to this contribution)

We have had some great contributions from both sides of the House. There were seven Back-Bench sp...

William Cash | 586 c1108 (Link to this contribution)

In my hon. Friend’s historical survey, has he noticed that the reason why the Triennial and Septe...

Sam Gyimah | 586 c1109 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for his point. There were, of course, many other times when Parliament has...

Jacob Rees-Mogg | 586 c1109 (Link to this contribution)

I have a mild disagreement with my hon. Friend the Member for Stone (Sir William Cash). I think i...

Sam Gyimah | 586 c1109 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for that excellent intervention. Parliament has had this debate several ti...

Richard Drax | 586 c1109 (Link to this contribution)

I do not agree with the Minister on that last point. Our country has faced far greater dangers th...

Sam Gyimah | 586 c1110 (Link to this contribution)

I was incredibly nervous when our country was on the brink of financial and economic collapse aft...

Edward Leigh | 586 c1110 (Link to this contribution)

If fixed-term Parliaments were such a good idea, why did we not put them in our manifesto?

Sam Gyimah | 586 c1110 (Link to this contribution)

There are many good ideas that were not in our manifesto; it is important that we, as politicians...

Andrew Gwynne | 586 c1110 (Link to this contribution)

The Minister means “the right hon. Gentleman”.

Sam Gyimah | 586 cc1110-1 (Link to this contribution)

I meant to say “the right hon. Gentleman”. I stand corrected.

By setting out the general el...

Graham Allen | 586 c1111 (Link to this contribution)

The Minister is making a thoughtful and cogent speech. Now that we have a fixed-term Parliament a...

Sam Gyimah | 586 cc1111-2 (Link to this contribution)

As the hon. Gentleman knows, the convention in this country is that a Parliament cannot bind futu...

John Redwood | 586 c1112 (Link to this contribution)

Can the Minister explain why passing a lot of laws is a good idea? Have we not got enough laws al...

Sam Gyimah | 586 c1112 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my right hon. Friend for that point, which comes as no surprise to me. He would agree tha...

Lindsay Hoyle | 586 c1112 (Link to this contribution)

For up to two minutes, I call Sir Edward Leigh.

2.39 pm

Edward Leigh | 586 c1112 (Link to this contribution)

I am very grateful to everyone who has taken part in this thoughtful debate. I am grateful to the...

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