UK Parliament / Open data

Welfare Reform Bill

Debate on bills and Committee proceeding on Thursday, 20 October 2011, in the House of Lords, led by Baroness Hollis of Heigham. The answering member was Lord Freud.
Welfare Reform Bill. Lords committee stage sixth day. Clauses 11-12 considered. Committee adjourned. Grand Committee held in Committee room 4A.
Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
731 c111-72GC 
Session
2010-12
Legislative stage
Committee stage
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords Grand Committee
Proceeding contributions
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c114-20GC (Link to this contribution) I shall speak also to Amendment 46. These amendments are on shared accommodation. Thanks to the aler...
Lord German | 731 c160GC (Link to this contribution) 48C: Clause 11, page 5, line 29, at end insert— ““( ) In relation to a dwelling of which the landlor...

Show all contributions (93)
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c170GC (Link to this contribution) Is the Minister prepared to introduce a subsequent clause at a later stage which would give priority...
Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 731 c146GC (Link to this contribution) As the Minister rightly said, when he was here the noble Lord, Lord Newton, who is a former Secretar...
Lord Whitty | 731 c159GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I thank the Minister for his reply to the amendments, but I still do not understand why he...
Lord Freud | 731 c159GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I did not address absolutely smack on that particular point from the noble Lord. The revie...
Lord Whitty | 731 c159GC (Link to this contribution) In which case, the Minister did oversell it, at least to me. I am glad he has backed off from that b...
Lord German | 731 c160GC (Link to this contribution) Can we identify where the very annoying continuous F# is coming from in this Room and distracting me...
Lord Freud | 731 c157GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, in response to the question from the noble Baroness, we are developing how we would integr...
Lord Freud | 731 c157-8GC (Link to this contribution) We are integrating the housing benefit process into the universal credit. Clearly, local authorities...
Lord Freud | 731 c158-9GC (Link to this contribution) Yes, my Lords. I accept the importance of communication in this process. This is a large change—in m...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 731 c158GC (Link to this contribution) Can the Minister help me on one point? His response was very helpful, and we look forward to 3 Novem...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 731 c167-8GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, experience leads us to conclude that the most appropriate approach is for tenants to have ...
Lord Freud | 731 c169-70GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, one of the key principles of our welfare reforms is to make the whole experience of claimi...
Lord Stoneham of Droxford | 731 c165-6GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, many arguments have been very well made but there is one argument I wish to put particular...
Earl of Listowel | 731 c166-7GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have four brief points. I apologise to the Committee for failing to remind your Lordship...
Lord Best | 731 c160GC (Link to this contribution) 49: After Clause 11, insert the following new Clause— ““Payment of housing costs (1) This section ap...
Lord Haskel | 731 c160GC (Link to this contribution) It comes from the circulation of air. I have been in here before when it has happened. I think the e...
Lord Whitty | 731 c165GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I strongly support the amendment and wish to underline two points. First, if the great pro...
Baroness Lister of Burtersett | 731 c165GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Best, and the noble Baroness, Lady Meacher, made a very comprehensive...
Baroness Meacher | 731 c163-5GC (Link to this contribution) I rise to support Amendment 49, tabled by my noble friend Lord Best. I understand the Government’s a...
Lord Best | 731 c160-3GC (Link to this contribution) I suspect that this is the last amendment we are going to have time for, so we are on the home stret...
Lord Best | 731 c170-2GC (Link to this contribution) I shall make three quick points in conclusion. First, the well-being of tenants is very much what ha...
Earl of Listowel | 731 c170GC (Link to this contribution) On the vital work incentives—I am sure this is a discussion I should have heard and missed earlier—i...
Lord De Mauley | 731 c172GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this might be a convenient moment for the Committee to adjourn until 3.30 pm on Monday.
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 731 c170GC (Link to this contribution) What if there is no way through? Will the Minister reconsider his policy position?
Lord Freud | 731 c170GC (Link to this contribution) That is exactly the structure we need, but how does one find a way? It may be an escrow account in w...
Baroness Wilkins | 731 c143GC (Link to this contribution) Could the noble Lord remind the Committee when that review is likely to report?
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c135-6GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, that does not follow at all. We know that, currently, 50 per cent of NRPs lose contact wit...
Lord Freud | 731 c135GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Earl raises the complex issue, which we have been looking at very closely, of whether exem...
Earl of Listowel | 731 c136GC (Link to this contribution) I would be grateful to the Minister for that.
Lord Freud | 731 c136GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, to make myself absolutely clear, the scale that I was indicating—perhaps I should write on...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c139GC (Link to this contribution) 47: Clause 11, page 5, line 29, at end insert— ““(6) Regulations shall provide that the Secretary of...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c136-8GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am very grateful indeed to everyone who took part in a very illuminating and informative...
Lord Best | 731 c141-3GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, as we would all expect, that was a comprehensive exposition in support of the amendment. W...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c139-41GC (Link to this contribution) Noble Lords will be pleased to see that I shall sit down after this amendment. I apologise for tresp...
Earl of Listowel | 731 c135GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for the Minister’s response. I want to clarify a point about parents and children and ...
Lord Freud | 731 c145GC (Link to this contribution) That is rather hard on the Conservative Back-Benchers who have been attending regularly.
Lord Foulkes of Cumnock | 731 c145GC (Link to this contribution) If the Government are doing all of this, why has the Minister not been able to persuade any Conserva...
Lord Freud | 731 c144-5GC (Link to this contribution) I should start by reminding your Lordships of the context of this: the rapid growth in housing expen...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 731 c147GC (Link to this contribution) Will they publish rent levels on a monthly basis as they currently do?
Lord Freud | 731 c146-7GC (Link to this contribution) Now we hear the nub of it. The noble Lord wishes that all Conservative Back-Benchers should have a g...
Lord Freud | 731 c145-6GC (Link to this contribution) If you want me to, I can name my noble friend Lord Skelmersdale, who has been regularly in his place...
Lord Best | 731 c143GC (Link to this contribution) The review is in three parts. We will get an interim report next spring, a more detailed report this...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 731 c143-4GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we support these amendments in the names of the noble Lord, Lord Best, and the noble Baron...
Lord Whitty | 731 c149GC (Link to this contribution) 48A: Clause 11, page 5, line 29, at end insert— ““( ) Inclusion of the housing cost element in the c...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c149GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister for that elucidation and, with the committee’s consent, withdraw the a...
Lord Whitty | 731 c149-51GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I shall also speak to Amendment 48B. There are some other amendments in the name of my nob...
Lord Freud | 731 c148GC (Link to this contribution) It is worth dealing with this issue now and making absolutely clear what is happening. We are having...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c148GC (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the Minister. We are passing each other by on the word reconsideration. For me, rec...
Lord Freud | 731 c148GC (Link to this contribution) Yes, because by the middle of 2013 we will have some of the best evidence we have ever had and I wil...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c148GC (Link to this contribution) Sorry, so the Minister is saying he will be reconsidering the evidence in two years’ time?
Lord Freud | 731 c147GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am not sure. We have not established the exact arrangements about how that will work at ...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c147GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Best, and my noble friend Lord McKenzie, as well as ...
Lord Freud | 731 c148GC (Link to this contribution) It might help the noble Baroness if we clear up the meaning of the language here. When you reconside...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c157GC (Link to this contribution) I am not absolutely clear what the Minister means by the involvement here of local authority staff. ...
Lord Freud | 731 c156-7GC (Link to this contribution) Let me continue now with Amendments 119 and 120, which would postpone the inclusion of support for h...
Lord Knight of Weymouth | 731 c156GC (Link to this contribution) I have to say that the Minister was just getting interesting.
Lord Freud | 731 c155-6GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I think that I should probably explain my assertion rather than give evidence for it. I us...
Lord Knight of Weymouth | 731 c155GC (Link to this contribution) I am sorry to interrupt the Minister, but it is a disease of politicians to assert things in that wa...
Lord Freud | 731 c155GC (Link to this contribution) There are a number of amendments in this group, but before I start perhaps I should take this opport...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 731 c153-4GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I should like to comment on some of the amendments. We touched on the issue raised by the ...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c154GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, there is a distinction between local assessment and local payment. We discussed some of th...
Baroness Donaghy | 731 c151-2GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, in supporting the two amendments of the noble Lord, Lord Whitty, my point is much narrower...
Lord Knight of Weymouth | 731 c152-3GC (Link to this contribution) I support what my noble friend has just said. I set out at some length at Second Reading why conside...
Baroness Hayter of Kentish Town | 731 c112GC (Link to this contribution) I shall also be brief. As my noble friend Lady Hollis has made clear already, the non-dependent adul...
Lord Freud | 731 c113GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the principle of non-dependent deductions has been accepted by successive Governments sinc...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c114GC (Link to this contribution) I am very grateful for that. If I may say so, because I do not want to sound patronising, it is a ve...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c114GC (Link to this contribution) 45: Clause 11, page 5, line 29, at end insert— ““( ) Regulations shall provide that where the award ...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c111GC (Link to this contribution) 37: Clause 11, page 5, line 23, at end insert— ““( ) Regulations shall provide that any deduction or...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c111-2GC (Link to this contribution) Noble Lords will be relieved to hear that I shall be brief on this. A non-dependent adult is likely...
Baroness Hollis of Heigham | 731 c124GC (Link to this contribution) In terms of the groups that I identified in Amendment 45, which ones would the noble Lord not protec...
Lord Stoneham of Droxford | 731 c125GC (Link to this contribution) I have looked at the group and the Government have already addressed quite a lot of them. The noble ...
Earl of Listowel | 731 c122-3GC (Link to this contribution) I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Hollis, for tabling these amendments to ensure that we thoroughly t...
Lord Stoneham of Droxford | 731 c123-4GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, spoke in the debate last week that the noble Lord, Lord Kirkwood, initiated, so I ...
Lord McAvoy | 731 c127-8GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, this could be a repeat of a previous debate. I am not going to say anything about Amendmen...
Baroness Campbell of Surbiton | 731 c128-9GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I would also like to support the noble Baroness, Lady Hollis, on these two important amend...
Baroness Thomas of Winchester | 731 c125GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I endorse what my noble friend has just said about the scarcity of properties around the c...
Baroness Sherlock | 731 c125-7GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I have a couple of things to say. To add to what the noble Baroness, Lady Thomas, has just...
Lord Kirkwood of Kirkhope | 731 c120-1GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the Committee owes the noble Baroness a debt. These amendments are entirely appropriate an...
Baroness Lister of Burtersett | 731 c121-2GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I, too, took part in the debate last week and I will not repeat everything that I said the...
Lord Freud | 731 c133GC (Link to this contribution) Yes, my Lords. The whole point of the localism agenda is that choices can be made at the local level...
Lord Wigley | 731 c133GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for that response and clarification. He will be as aware as ...
Lord Freud | 731 c133GC (Link to this contribution) Yes, my Lords. We are currently looking at how to allocate the additional discretionary payments to ...
Lord McKenzie of Luton | 731 c133-4GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Lord was talking about the importance of localism and how you could make local decisions a...
Lord Freud | 731 c134GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, it is probably not appropriate to go into great depth on the theory of localism, and the n...
Baroness Meacher | 731 c134GC (Link to this contribution) I must apologise to noble Lords that I was unable to be here at the beginning of this debate. Howeve...
Lord Freud | 731 c134-5GC (Link to this contribution) The noble Baroness, Lady Meacher, makes an important point. It is interesting how there is some supp...
Baroness Hayter of Kentish Town | 731 c129-31GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, we have learnt some interesting things in this debate. First, the Minister is not a bad ma...
Lord Freud | 731 c131-3GC (Link to this contribution) My Lords, the change to the shared accommodation rate was comprehensively debated last Wednesday, 12...
Lord Wigley | 731 c133GC (Link to this contribution) I hope noble Lords will excuse my ignorance on this, but can the Minister clarify whether, if a loca...
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