UK Parliament / Open data

Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Bill

Committee of the Whole House (HL) and Debate on bills on Wednesday, 19 June 2013, in the House of Lords.
Lords committee stage second day. Clauses 6 to 11 agreed to, with clause 5 agreed to as amended. Schedules 1 and 2 agreed to. Schedule 3 agreed to as amended. Schedule 4 under consideration when House adjourned. Part 2 of 2.
Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
746 cc325-382 
Session
2013-14
Legislative stage
Committee stage
Procedure
New clauses
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords chamber
Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Bill 2012-13 to 2013-14. Brought from the Commons.
Tuesday, 21 May 2013
Bills
House of Lords
Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform Committee fourth report.
Wednesday, 12 June 2013
Parliamentary committees
House of Lords
Deposited Paper DEP2013-1077
Thursday, 27 June 2013
Deposited papers
House of Lords
Deposited Paper DEP2013-1111
Tuesday, 2 July 2013
Deposited papers
House of Lords

Show all related items (6)
Deposited Paper DEP2013-1127
Tuesday, 2 July 2013
Deposited papers
House of Lords
Deposited Paper DEP2013-1138
Thursday, 4 July 2013
Deposited papers
House of Lords
Proceeding contributions
Lord Curry of Kirkharle | 746 c325 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Curry of Kirkharle

20: Clause 4, page 5, line 33, at end insert—

...

Lord Curry of Kirkharle | 746 cc325-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am deeply concerned about the potentially divisive nature of this Bill. Mention was m...


Show all contributions (114)
Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 c328 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I rise to speak in favour of Amendment 22, which is in my name. Very detailed considera...

Baroness Barker | 746 cc328-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have been listening with great care to many of the arguments which the noble Lord, Lo...

Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 c329 (Link to this contribution)

I did not say that it was not the job of religions to go along with society. Religions are formul...

Baroness Barker | 746 c329 (Link to this contribution)

I do not wish to enter into what I think is something of a distraction. I agree with the noble Lo...

Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 c329 (Link to this contribution)

Again, I have not for a moment said that the rest live in a moral vacuum. I simply stated what re...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 cc329-330 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I will address the amendments moved by the noble Lords, Lord Curry of Kirkharle and Lor...

Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 c330 (Link to this contribution)

It may be that no disrespect is intended, but disrespect has been taken and many people are extre...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 cc330-2 (Link to this contribution)

I apologise if any disrespect has been taken; it was certainly not the intention. A general refer...

Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 c332 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful for what has been said, but it does not really explain the concerns at all. If ther...

Lord Elton | 746 c332 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this echoes precisely what I was saying at Second Reading. It is a very good example of...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 cc332-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I appreciate the point that the noble Lord, Lord Singh, is making, but I ask him to ref...

Lord Pannick | 746 c333 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I would just add that if the state were to conduct such an exercise and purport to deci...

Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 c333 (Link to this contribution)

Having heard that, I will not move my amendment, with the proviso that what I have suggested shou...

Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 c333 (Link to this contribution)

Thank you, but I will not move my amendment.

Lord Curry of Kirkharle | 746 c333 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I reinforce that. The Bill itself, as I said in my comments and has been said numerous ...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 cc333-4 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Wallace of Tankerness

21: Clause 5, page 6, line 18, leave out from “pu...

Lord Dear | 746 cc334-5 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Dear

23: After Clause 7, insert the following new Clause—

“School...

Lord Dear | 746 cc335-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I see that Amendments 23 and 24 are grouped together. I had discussions earlier with th...

Lord Waddington | 746 c337 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Dear, brought to the attention of the House certain remarks made b...

Lord Alli | 746 c337 (Link to this contribution)

Teachers in any context need to teach the legal position. Is the noble Lord suggesting that they ...

Lord Waddington | 746 c337 (Link to this contribution)

I appreciate what the noble Lord has to say and he will be able to say it in his speech. I wish h...

Lord Alli | 746 c338 (Link to this contribution)

I was shaking my head because I do not believe that it is difficult for a teacher to teach the fa...

Lord Waddington | 746 cc338-9 (Link to this contribution)

A number of teachers will find it extremely difficult to have to explain the new regime. At Secon...

Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 746 cc339-340 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I say in a spirit of courtesy that I rather resent the reference to this side of the Ch...

Lord Dear | 746 c340 (Link to this contribution)

I wonder whether the noble Baroness could apply that reasoning to the letter that I quoted. I wil...

Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 746 cc340-1 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, my experience in my political career is that it is unwise to comment on individual case...

Lord Pannick | 746 cc341-2 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, we all recognise the strength of feeling that these issues command, and pleas for toler...

Lord Dear | 746 c342 (Link to this contribution)

Would the noble Lord then distinguish that from the circumstances of a teacher who is an atheist ...

Lord Pannick | 746 c342 (Link to this contribution)

An atheist may have good reason for not teaching religious education, because by definition relig...

Lord Dear | 746 c342 (Link to this contribution)

With the greatest possible respect, that is dancing on a pin. I am sorry to put it that way, beca...

Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 746 c342 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, would the noble Lord, Lord Dear, please accept that he is referring to two separate iss...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 cc342-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, perhaps I may put in my 10 cents-worth on this. I entirely agree with the noble Lord, L...

Lord Alli | 746 c343 (Link to this contribution)

I wonder if the noble and learned Baroness has seen the Secretary of State’s Second Reading speec...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 c343 (Link to this contribution)

I very much hope that that is true. It may be that this is not necessary in primary legislation. ...

Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 746 c344 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, does the noble and learned Baroness accept that I have failed to convey the message of ...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 c344 (Link to this contribution)

I do not want to keep getting up and down. I entirely agree with the noble Baroness, but since sh...

Baroness Byford | 746 c344 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have waited patiently and tried about five times to get in, because this part of the ...

Lord Alli | 746 c345 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I shall be brief because I know that the Committee wants to make progress and there is ...

Lord Elton | 746 c345 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, there are a couple of things which have not been mentioned that we need to bear in mind...

Lord Eden of Winton | 746 cc345-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I believe that it was the noble Lord, Lord Dear, who said that this is something of kni...

Lord Alli | 746 c346 (Link to this contribution)

In the spirit of tolerance that the noble Lord, Lord Waddington, asked for, will the noble Lord a...

Lord Eden of Winton | 746 c346 (Link to this contribution)

I am very sorry to hear the noble Lord say that because I certainly do not want to offend him or ...

Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton | 746 c347 (Link to this contribution)

I remind the noble Lord that the example in Lancashire that I spoke of was in a Church of England...

Lord Eden of Winton | 746 c347 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the noble Baroness for that intervention, which reminds me, if I needed reminding, of her...

Lord Glenarthur | 746 c347 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I hesitate to intervene because I have not spoken since Second Reading. However, I want...

Baroness Barker | 746 c347 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have a question for the Minister arising from the speech of the noble and learned Bar...

Lord Elton | 746 c347 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Lord has not, as far as I know, addressed his second amendment at all. I do not think t...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c348 (Link to this contribution)

I will address both Amendment 23 and Amendment 24, as the noble Lord, Lord Dear, himself said—

Lord Dear | 746 c348 (Link to this contribution)

I am so sorry. Perhaps I may directly address the Front Bench. We agreed that we would try to hur...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c348 (Link to this contribution)

I apologise to the noble Lord if I was in any way unclear when we discussed this. I thought, from...

Lord Dear | 746 cc348-9 (Link to this contribution)

If it is the will of the Committee I will move on to Amendment 24. Yes, the Front Bench is noddin...

Baroness Thornton | 746 cc349-350 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, third time lucky. Amendments 23 and 24 in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Dear, addres...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 cc350-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, as I said to the noble Lord, Lord Dear, I am grateful to be able to respond to his Amen...

Lord Elton | 746 c353 (Link to this contribution)

Did I understand my noble friend to say that parents are not now allowed to withdraw their childr...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c353 (Link to this contribution)

I am happy to confirm to my noble friend that parents are indeed allowed to withdraw their childr...

Lord Dear | 746 cc353-4 (Link to this contribution)

I am very grateful to the Minister for the way in which she has summed up and the way in which sh...

Lord Elton | 746 cc354-5 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Elton

24C: Clause 9, page 9, line 23, at end insert—

“(3A) Regula...

Lord Elton | 746 c355 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have gleaned a little popularity that way. I hope that I will now get a good receptio...

Lord Geddes | 746 c355 (Link to this contribution)

I assume that the noble Lord would like to move his amendment.

Lord Elton | 746 c355 (Link to this contribution)

I thought commendation amounted to movement. However, I beg leave to move the amendment.

Baroness Northover | 746 cc355-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, Amendment 24C sets out a procedure for the conversion from civil partnership to marriag...

Lord Elton | 746 c356 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I was very interested in the terms in which my noble friend asked me to do that. I wond...

Baroness Northover | 746 c356 (Link to this contribution)

My noble friend has neatly rolled up his previous amendment as well. I am aware of the Delegated ...

Lord Elton | 746 c357 (Link to this contribution)

That said, and anxiously awaiting developments, which I hope will be ahead of Report stage so tha...

Lord Elton | 746 c357 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I apologise. I gave notice that I had a point to raise, but it was drawn inevitably int...

Lord Alli | 746 c357 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Alli

26A: Clause 10, page 11, line 1, leave out subsection (3)

Lord Alli | 746 cc357-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the effect of Amendment 26A is to remove the schedule that converts same-sex marriages ...

Duke of Montrose | 746 cc358-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, my amendments are grouped with that of the noble Lord, Lord Alli. The reason is of cour...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 c359 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I find this part of the Bill quite extraordinary. I have the greatest possible sympathy...

Baroness Thornton | 746 cc359-360 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, Amendment 26A in the name of my noble friend Lord Alli would remove the special arrange...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 cc360-1 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I welcome the opportunity to clarify how the Bill, which makes provision for marriage o...

Lord Alli | 746 c361 (Link to this contribution)

But it does not have a legal status in Northern Ireland and Scotland because it is a marriage in ...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 cc361-3 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the position is that, as things stand at the moment, there is no provision in either Sc...

Duke of Montrose | 746 c363 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I always understood that the first purpose of an order was to be a blanket order to cov...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 c363 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the Scottish Parliament has agreed a legislative consent Motion to the provisions in th...

Lord Mackay of Clashfern | 746 c364 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, does it not require a statutory provision in Scotland to make this work? Therefore, it ...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 c364 (Link to this contribution)

As ever, my noble and learned friend expresses it far more concisely than I do.

Lord Alli | 746 c364 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank the Minister for that reply but, as he probably recognises, I am not happy with...

Lord Trefgarne | 746 c364 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Trefgarne

27: After Clause 10, insert the following new Clause—

“...

Lord Trefgarne | 746 cc364-5 (Link to this contribution)

This is in essence a probing amendment. However, like all good probing amendments, it has the mer...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c365 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I recommend that the noble Lord, Lord Trefgarne, should google marriages at sea. It say...

Baroness Northover | 746 cc365-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, my noble friend’s amendment would enable marriages of same-sex couples to be conducted ...

Lord Trefgarne | 746 c366 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have to be honest and say that I am more mystified than disappointed. Listening to th...

Lord Mackay of Clashfern | 746 c366 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Mackay of Clashfern

33: Clause 11, page 11, line 4, at beginning insert...

Lord Mackay of Clashfern | 746 cc366-7 (Link to this contribution)

This is an extremely simple point, but possibly of some importance. Clause 11 (1) says:

“In...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c367 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am grateful to my noble and learned friend and, as is clear from today’s list, this a...

Lord Mackay of Clashfern | 746 c367 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am very grateful and am happy to withdraw the amendment on that assurance that Parlia...

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara | 746 c367 (Link to this contribution)

Tabled by

Lord Stevenson of Balmacara

33A: Clause 11, page 11, leave out line 5 and i...

Lord Tunnicliffe | 746 cc367-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I rise to move Amendment 33A in the name of my noble friend Lord Stevenson of Balmacara...

Baroness Northover | 746 cc368-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this amendment seeks to ensure that the Bill would allow individuals who identify thems...

Lord Tunnicliffe | 746 c369 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank the Minister for her understanding response. It is the first time, I think, tha...

Baroness Northover | 746 c369 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Baroness Northover

38: Schedule 3, page 25, line 23, leave out “Paragraphs 1...

Baroness Northover | 746 cc369-371 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, in moving government Amendment 38 I will speak to the other government amendments in th...

Bishop of Guildford | 746 c370 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

The Lord Bishop of Guildford

39: Schedule 4, page 26, line 32, leave out par...

Bishop of Guildford | 746 cc370-2 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, it is agreed on all sides that parents make the most fundamental contribution to the fl...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 c372 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Northbourne, has asked me to speak on his behalf to Amendment 39A,...

Baroness Barker | 746 c373 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I want to thank the right reverend Prelate for the speech that he just gave. I thought ...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c373 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, my noble friend Lady Royall and I came to the same conclusion as the right reverend Pre...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 cc374-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I understand why noble Lords would want to seek clarification on this aspect of the Bil...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 c375 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Baroness Butler-Sloss

40: Schedule 4, page 27, line 4, leave out paragraph 3...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 cc375-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I will speak to Amendments 40 and 41. This is a sensitive issue and we are speaking, of...

Bishop of Guildford | 746 c377 (Link to this contribution)

Again, I support a probing amendment. I am concerned that marriages between people of the same se...

Lord Alli | 746 cc377-8 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the noble and learned Baroness for bringing forward this amendment. I have listened to wh...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c378 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I will merely say that my noble friend Lord Alli has put his finger on the point. This ...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c378 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I was wondering earlier how BBC Parliament would cope if this group of amendments came ...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 cc378-380 (Link to this contribution)

At least we are not going to be subject to an inquiry by Ofcom.

The effect of the amendment...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 c380 (Link to this contribution)

I have perhaps found this topic rather easier to talk about, having been a divorce judge and inde...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c380 (Link to this contribution)

I hope the noble and learned Baroness will forgive me for intervening very briefly. I absolutely ...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 c381 (Link to this contribution)

I hear what the Minister says and of course I accept that she is saying on behalf of the Governme...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c382 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Baroness Stowell of Beeston

42: Schedule 4, page 28, line 13, leave out “as ...

Back to top