UK Parliament / Open data

Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Bill

Committee of the Whole House (HL) and Debate on bills on Wednesday, 19 June 2013, in the House of Lords.
Lords committee stage second day. Clauses 2 and 3 agreed to. Part 1 of 2.
Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
746 cc259-311 
Session
2013-14
Legislative stage
Committee stage
Chamber / Committee
House of Lords chamber
Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Bill 2012-13 to 2013-14. Brought from the Commons.
Tuesday, 21 May 2013
Bills
House of Lords
Delegated Powers and Regulatory Reform Committee fourth report.
Wednesday, 12 June 2013
Parliamentary committees
House of Lords
Proceeding contributions
Baroness O'Loan | 746 cc259-260 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Baroness O'Loan

13: Clause 2, page 4, line 9, at end insert—

“( ) For ...

Baroness O'Loan | 746 cc260-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I reiterate my membership of the Joint Committee on Human Rights, whose report on the i...


Show all contributions (102)
Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 c265 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I shall speak in favour of Amendment 13. As was mentioned on Monday and has been mentio...

Lord Hylton | 746 cc265-6 (Link to this contribution)

I shall speak to Amendment 17. I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Berridge, for adding her name to ...

Lord Lester of Herne Hill | 746 cc266-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I declare an interest because I, too, was a member of the Joint Committee on Human Righ...

Baroness Berridge | 746 cc267-8 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I rise to speak to Amendments 17 and 18, which are in my name. Although they have both ...

Baroness Knight of Collingtree | 746 c268 (Link to this contribution)

I just want to ask my noble friend to look at history and recall the number of times—as I made cl...

Baroness Berridge | 746 cc268-271 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to my noble friend for her intervention and I will look back—I am afraid as a newer...

Lord Alli | 746 c271 (Link to this contribution)

I am a little confused again. Is the noble Baroness saying that the quadruple lock is not secure?...

Baroness Berridge | 746 c271 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the noble Lord for that helpful intervention. That has been the Government’s position loo...

Lord Alli | 746 c271 (Link to this contribution)

I apologise again to the noble Baroness. I am trying to get to the core of the mischief here and ...

Baroness Berridge | 746 cc271-2 (Link to this contribution)

If you attend a Catholic church, the authorised person is the registrar. No one comes from the lo...

Lord Deben | 746 cc272-3 (Link to this contribution)

I want to try to bring two sides together on this issue. I hope people will recognise that I am e...

Lord Cormack | 746 c273 (Link to this contribution)

I agree very much with my noble friend, whom I thank for giving way, but I hope that he was not s...

Lord Deben | 746 cc273-4 (Link to this contribution)

I listened to the whole debate almost without exception, and there were one or two sentences that...

Lord Alli | 746 c274 (Link to this contribution)

I apologise to the noble Baroness for taking more than my usual length of time to understand the ...

Baroness Berridge | 746 c274 (Link to this contribution)

I will respond to the noble Lord, Lord Alli. I am not seeking a cast-iron guarantee. I have previ...

Lord Pannick | 746 cc274-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I entirely understand the concerns that have been expressed by the noble Baronesses, La...

Lord Cormack | 746 cc275-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I courteously recognise the forensic skills and deep legal knowledge of the noble Lord,...

Lord Lester of Herne Hill | 746 c276 (Link to this contribution)

I hope I am not interrupting at the wrong moment, but will my noble friend agree that we have to ...

Lord Cormack | 746 cc276-7 (Link to this contribution)

Of course, but it is not unknown for a wise, enlightened, independent judiciary, which I strongly...

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 746 c277 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, although this has been an immensely courteous debate, I would start by wholeheartedly a...

Baroness O'Loan | 746 c277 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, for the sake of clarification, I did not speak on behalf of the committee but declared ...

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 746 cc277-8 (Link to this contribution)

I beg the noble Baroness’s pardon. It is interesting that both noble Baronesses, and the noble Lo...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 cc278-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I will start by thanking the noble Baroness, Lady O’Loan, my noble friend Lady Berridge...

Baroness Knight of Collingtree | 746 c279 (Link to this contribution)

On that very point, why is it that registrars who from conscience, from their heart and beliefs, ...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 cc279-280 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, obviously they cannot yet have been sacked because of this legislation, because it is n...

Lord Lester of Herne Hill | 746 c280 (Link to this contribution)

Does my noble and learned friend also agree that the Human Rights Act compels this legislation to...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 cc280-2 (Link to this contribution)

Indeed, my noble friend is right. Article 9 of the European Convention on Human Rights gives that...

Lord Cormack | 746 c283 (Link to this contribution)

Perhaps I could remind my noble and learned friend of my other suggestion: that detailed conversa...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 c283 (Link to this contribution)

If my noble friend had allowed me to finish the sentence that I had started when he intervened, I...

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 746 c283 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I do not wish to be consulted, but I suggest that the document or letter is put into th...

Lord Elton | 746 c283 (Link to this contribution)

May I suggest that all those who have taken part in the debate should have a copy sent directly? ...

Lord Wallace of Tankerness | 746 c283 (Link to this contribution)

My noble friend has taken part in the debate and I usually make it a matter of practice to send a...

Baroness O'Loan | 746 cc283-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank noble Lords who took part in this debate. The noble Lords, Lord Lester and Lord...

Lord Carey of Clifton | 746 c284 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Carey of Clifton

15: Clause 2, page 4, line 20, at end insert—

“(...

Lord Carey of Clifton | 746 cc284-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, before I address the amendment, perhaps I may refer to an earlier speech by the noble B...

Lord Alli | 746 c286 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the noble and right reverend Lord for giving way. I know that he will know the Church of ...

Lord Carey of Clifton | 746 c286 (Link to this contribution)

Yes. I thank the noble Lord for that intervention but I am referring to nonconformist churches wh...

Lord Alli | 746 c286 (Link to this contribution)

That would not be possible in the Church of England, for example, where there can be no blessing ...

Lord Carey of Clifton | 746 c286 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Lord is exactly right but I am not talking about the Church of England because there ar...

Lord Deben | 746 cc286-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this is entirely misconceived. This Bill is not about blessings. The church has a right...

Lord Pannick | 746 c287 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this amendment is concerned with Section 29 which is related to the exercise of public ...

Baroness Barker | 746 c288 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Deben, used the word “courtesy”. I wish to make a plea for clarity...

Baroness Royall of Blaisdon | 746 c288 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Deben, that, as legislators working on the Bill, our ...

Baroness Northover | 746 cc288-9 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I thank the noble and right reverend Lord, Lord Carey, for flagging this issue so that ...

Lord Tebbit | 746 c289 (Link to this contribution)

My noble friend referred to Clause 2(2) which states that:

“A person may not be compelled”....

Baroness Northover | 746 c289 (Link to this contribution)

I am not sure if my noble friend was in his place for the earlier debate, but we had quite an ext...

Lord Tebbit | 746 c290 (Link to this contribution)

I was here for a substantial part of that debate, but not all of it. I ask a simple question: is ...

Lord Carlile of Berriew | 746 c290 (Link to this contribution)

My noble friend is able to offer free advice on this.

Lord Lester of Herne Hill | 746 c290 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, it comes free. When the noble Baroness replied to the noble Lord, Lord Tebbit, she may have ...

Baroness Northover | 746 c290 (Link to this contribution)

I find it amazing that my noble friend Lord Lester knows what is inside my head when I myself do ...

Lord Carey of Clifton | 746 c290 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am grateful for this brief debate and I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Deben, that c...

Lord Harrison | 746 c291 (Link to this contribution)

Moved by

Lord Harrison

19A: Clause 3, page 4, line 38, at end insert—

“(cc) a m...

Lord Harrison | 746 cc291-4 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I shall speak also to Amendments 22A and 27A. I am so sorry that the noble and right re...

Baroness Massey of Darwen | 746 cc292-6 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I rise to speak briefly in support of my noble friend’s amendments and of this Bill. Th...

Lord Garel-Jones | 746 cc296-7 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I support the amendment moved by the noble Lord, Lord Harrison, and the new schedule pr...

Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 c297 (Link to this contribution)

On the question of religions falling out of step with civil society, religions are there to give ...

Lord Garel-Jones | 746 c297 (Link to this contribution)

With the greatest respect, I agree except that I would put it the other way around. The danger th...

Lord Singh of Wimbledon | 746 cc297-8 (Link to this contribution)

I apologise, but the noble Lord refers to religions—he has clarified the issue now—and gives the ...

Lord Garel-Jones | 746 c298 (Link to this contribution)

As I say, I am not the best person to be advising churches on how to handle the like. However, re...

Bishop of Guildford | 746 c298 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I greatly appreciate both the humour of the noble Lord, Lord Garel-Jones, and the court...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c298 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the right reverend Prelate for allowing me to interject on the subject of the celebrant-b...

Bishop of Guildford | 746 c299 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful for that point of information and I accept that clarification.

The other issu...

Baroness Brinton | 746 cc299-300 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I would like up to pick up on the right reverend Prelate’s last point about the curious...

Lord Elton | 746 c300 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Baroness is very persuasive and I am not at all against what is proposed. But perhaps I...

Baroness Turner of Camden | 746 c300 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, as I said at Second Reading, I am a secularist, but I accept that many people are relig...

Lord Lester of Herne Hill | 746 cc301-2 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am a lapsed humanist. When I was at Cambridge I was a member of the most privileged c...

Lord Alli | 746 c302 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am not a humanist; I am afraid I am a closet believer in God. But I wanted to add my ...

Lord Eden of Winton | 746 c302 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, before the Minister replies to the debate, I would like to follow up the observations m...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c303 (Link to this contribution)

Does the noble Lord think that the humanists need to wait another 19 years for another Bill to co...

Lord Eden of Winton | 746 c303 (Link to this contribution)

I am afraid that that is not the immediate problem. The problem is the impact on this legislation...

Lord Aberdare | 746 c303 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I have no specific expertise on humanism and am not a humanist myself. Indeed, I am gra...

Baroness Thornton | 746 cc303-5 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, this has been an excellent debate. I say to the noble Lords, Lord Lester and Lord Eden,...

Lord Lester of Herne Hill | 746 c305 (Link to this contribution)

I wonder if the noble Baroness can explain the position on Long Titles, because it may well be th...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c305 (Link to this contribution)

The point that I was making at the outset of my remarks—the noble Lord is an expert at getting le...

Lord Mackay of Clashfern | 746 c305 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I think that I am right in saying that it is not without precedent for a Long Title to ...

Baroness Thornton | 746 cc305-6 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the noble and learned Lord for that remark. That is indeed the case.

I conclude my ...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c306 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Harrison, for introducing the amendment and for e...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c306 (Link to this contribution)

The noble Baroness needs to acknowledge that humanism is a system of belief. It is quite wrong to...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c306 (Link to this contribution)

I accept that point. Forgive me if I was suggesting anything that was not respectful of what huma...

Lord Harrison | 746 c307 (Link to this contribution)

The amendment sets out the conditions whereby it would be permissible in the particular case of t...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c307 (Link to this contribution)

I understand the point that the noble Lord is making. As I said when I began, there is quite a lo...

Lord Harrison | 746 c307 (Link to this contribution)

We are proposing this under the existing requirement in Section 27 of the Marriage Act 1949. We d...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 cc307-8 (Link to this contribution)

I will cover that point in the course of my response.

The point still stands—I will explain...

Lord Lester of Herne Hill | 746 c308 (Link to this contribution)

I am sorry to interrupt and I hope I am not being a nuisance by doing so. Is not one reason in fa...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c308 (Link to this contribution)

I was trying to make the simple point that the concern that the Attorney-General raised at that t...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c308 (Link to this contribution)

I am very puzzled by what the noble Baroness is saying. She is now saying that there are other gr...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 cc308-9 (Link to this contribution)

I do not have the copy of Hansard in front of me for the debates that took place in the other pla...

Baroness Thornton | 746 c309 (Link to this contribution)

Are these implications deal breakers or are they administrative and technical details that could ...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c310 (Link to this contribution)

The responsibility I have as the Minister responding to this debate is to make clear that somethi...

Lord Alli | 746 c310 (Link to this contribution)

There is huge respect for the Minister in this House and for the way in which she has conducted t...

Lord Garel-Jones | 746 c310 (Link to this contribution)

Before my noble friend replies to that, she will, I am sure, have observed that not a single voic...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 cc310-1 (Link to this contribution)

I was about to conclude my remarks in any case. I am grateful to my noble friend. The noble Lord ...

Lord Lester of Herne Hill | 746 c311 (Link to this contribution)

I am trying to helpful. Why can the Government not adopt the same approach as the previous Govern...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c311 (Link to this contribution)

I am not in a position to offer to noble Lords today the kind of specific response that my noble ...

Baroness Butler-Sloss | 746 c311 (Link to this contribution)

I have sat listening to this for an extremely long time. I do not have any views at all about whe...

Baroness Stowell of Beeston | 746 c311 (Link to this contribution)

Very briefly, before I finally sit down, of course everybody would support humanist marriages. Th...

Lord Harris of Haringey | 746 c311 (Link to this contribution)

My Lords, I am in severe danger of letting the nice side of my character come to the fore at this...

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