My Lords, with Clause 2 we come to the kernel of the Bill. As your Lordships will know, that clause at the moment reads:
“A person is not disqualified from succeeding to the Crown or from possessing it as a result of marrying a person of the Roman Catholic faith”.
It is a simple, unambiguous statement, but it leaves a lot of questions unanswered. These are questions of profound significance to our constitution. Therefore, I am going to suggest that we add the amendment that I have tabled, which continues that clause by saying,
“provided that agreement has been reached with the Vatican that any children of the union can be brought up as Anglicans”.
We have talked recently about clarity; my noble friend Lord True talked about it in his amendment. We have also talked about certainty. Like my noble
friend Lord True, I was prevented from taking part in the Second Reading debate. I was sorry that I could not listen to much of the debate, but I was utterly committed to an event that took me away for some two or three hours—otherwise, I would have tried to air this subject then. That is why I put down an amendment which I hope is helpful to your Lordships’ House and will improve the Bill.
We have in England an established church, of which the Queen is the Supreme Governor. That is a fact and it is a constitutional fact of profound significance. I do not in any way wish to discriminate against any person of any faith, but our constitution rests on the fact that the monarch is the Supreme Governor of the established church. We have an established church; we have bishops who sit in this House and I am delighted to see the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of Derby here this afternoon. I hope that he will be able to contribute to this debate. We have an established church, which means that every man, woman and child in England has the right to the services of that church. Every one of us in England lives in a diocese; every one of us lives in a parish and every one of us is entitled to the services of the parish priest, the diocesan bishop and to the other appointed dignitaries. Every week, those of us who are practising Anglicans pray for the Queen as our Supreme Governor.
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I understand the motivations of those who have introduced this Bill. I think it has been rather rushed, and a number of noble Lords have mentioned the words “possible unintended consequences” during the course of our deliberations. We could be facing a very difficult unintended consequence if we do not further clarify the Bill in this particular regard. Therefore, I am suggesting that there should be some proper agreement or concordat—call it what you like—with the Vatican to say that the children of a union with a Roman Catholic partner in the marriage are not obliged, according to the Roman Catholic canon that exists, to be brought up in the Roman Catholic faith. We cannot have a Roman Catholic—in no sense is this casting aspersions on anybody—as Supreme Governor of the Anglican Church; it is just not possible. At the same time, this is such an integral part of our monarch’s role, and the establishment of the Church of England is so bound up with the constitution of our realm, that we need some form of concordat or agreement sanctioned at the highest level of the Roman Catholic Church. That means the Vatican and, ultimately, the Pope.
As I have referred to the Pope, perhaps noble Lords will forgive me if I digress for half a moment to express the warmest good wishes to His Holiness as he retires this very day from active service. He is a man for whom I have the highest possible regard, and many of us in the Chamber—and many in the House who are not in the Chamber this afternoon—were greatly moved when he addressed us in Westminster Hall a couple of years ago. I very much hope that the new Pope will be held in similar regard.
First, we need to talk formally with the Roman Catholic hierarchy in this country—with Vincent Nichols, the Archbishop of Westminster, and his senior colleagues. Then we need to make an approach to the Vatican, so
that there is no ambiguity or doubt that any children of such a union could be brought up as Anglicans. My proposition to noble Lords is very simple, but it is one of considerable importance and significance.
I do not claim that the words of my amendment, which is kindly supported by my noble friend Lord Freeman, are perfect—of course they are not. I am more than happy to talk to anybody, in any part of the House—with my noble friend the Minister and others—about different wording if that seems more appropriate. However, I feel completely convinced that there must be some reference along these lines in the Bill. If we pass the Bill into law and it becomes an Act with no such reference in it, we may be building up problems for the future that we do not want.
Some have suggested that in the event of our having a Roman Catholic sovereign, there could be some form of regency arrangement. That may sound superficially attractive, but a regency can last a very long time. Our beloved Queen has now been on the throne for 61 years. Had she been a Roman Catholic and had there been a regency, we might have gone through two or three regents in the time, so I do not think that that is an answer.
The only sensible—I will rephrase that—the only watertight answer is to have something in the Bill that makes it plain that an agreement has been reached with the highest authorities in the Roman Catholic Church that should such a union take place, the children of that union could be brought up as Anglicans and could therefore properly take on the very real and weighty task and obligation of being Supreme Governor of the Church of England. This is a responsibility that Her Majesty has taken extremely seriously throughout her reign, and that she has discharged with infinite wisdom and grace, and in a way of which we can all be proud, whatever our personal faith or lack of it. With those few words, I beg to move.