UK Parliament / Open data

Badger Cull

Backbench debate on Thursday, 13 March 2014, in the House of Commons, led by Anne Main. The answering member was George Eustice.
Thirty-second backbench debate. Motion that this House believes that the pilot badger culls in Gloucestershire and Somerset have decisively failed against the criteria set out by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs in guidance to Natural England for licensing of the culls, which stipulated that 70 per cent of the badger population should be culled within a six-week period; notes that the costs of policing, additional implementation and monitoring, and the resort to more expensive cage-and-trap methods over an extended period have substantially increased the cost of the culls, and strengthened the financial case for vaccination; regrets that the decision to extend the original culls has not been subject to any debate or vote in Parliament; further regrets that the Independent Expert Panel will only assess the humaneness, safety and effectiveness of the original six-week period and not the extended cull period; and urges the Government to halt the existing culls and granting of any further licences, pending development of alternative strategies to eradicate bovine TB and promote a healthy badger population. Agreed to on division (219 to 1).
Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
577 cc456-522 
Session
2013-14
Department
Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Proceeding contributions
Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 577 c456 (Link to this contribution)

Before I call the hon. Member for St Albans (Mrs Main) to propose the motion, I would like to dra...

Anne Main | 577 cc456-7 (Link to this contribution)

I beg to move,

That this House believes that the pilot badger culls in Gloucestershire and ...


Show all contributions (167)
Anne Main | 577 cc457-8 (Link to this contribution)

I am sorry, but I have indicated that I will not be taking interventions.

The public might ...

Mark Harper | 577 c458 (Link to this contribution)

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker—[Interruption.] Will Opposition Members listen to my po...

Huw Irranca-Davies | 577 c458 (Link to this contribution)

Further to that point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I may be able to help the hon. Member for F...

Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 577 c458 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the hon. Member for Forest of Dean (Mr Harper) for his point of order. It is not in fact ...

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown | 577 c458 (Link to this contribution)

Further to that point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. I always understood it to be a convention o...

Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 577 cc458-9 (Link to this contribution)

Order. I thank the hon. Gentleman for his point of order. That rule applies to Ministers; it does...

Anne Main | 577 c459 (Link to this contribution)

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I know that passions are running high in this matter.

My h...

Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 577 c459 (Link to this contribution)

Order. In these unusual circumstances, this incident be overlooked. As I said at the beginning of...

Anne Main | 577 cc459-461 (Link to this contribution)

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Perhaps it was a badger ringing me up and willing me on.

I...

Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 577 c460 (Link to this contribution)

Order. Before I call speakers from the Back Benches, may I say that it will be obvious to the Hou...

Angela C Smith | 577 c460 (Link to this contribution)

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker, and I will bear those comments in mind. Let me start by paying t...

Angela C Smith | 577 c462 (Link to this contribution)

Very briefly, because I am aware of the need to keep my contribution short.

David Heath | 577 c462 (Link to this contribution)

I appreciate that, and I am grateful to the hon. Lady for giving way. Given that a lot of people ...

Angela C Smith | 577 c462 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman has anticipated much of what I am going to say about the constructive way forw...

Meg Munn | 577 c462 (Link to this contribution)

The number of badgers in the area was one of the issues raised in previous debates. Obviously, th...

Angela C Smith | 577 cc462-3 (Link to this contribution)

This is the “badgers moving the goalposts” argument, which repeatedly comes back to haunt this de...

Angela C Smith | 577 c463 (Link to this contribution)

I will give way just one more time, because a lot of people want to speak.

Roger Williams | 577 c463 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the hon. Lady for giving way. She said that the randomised badger culling trials occurred...

Angela C Smith | 577 cc463-4 (Link to this contribution)

The reactive culling in the RBCT did fail. That is not the point. I am talking about proactive cu...

Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 577 c464 (Link to this contribution)

Order. I am sure that the hon. Lady will very soon draw her remarks to a close.

Angela C Smith | 577 cc464-5 (Link to this contribution)

Of course I will, Madam Deputy Speaker.

It must be remembered that cattle testing and movem...

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 577 c465 (Link to this contribution)

It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Penistone and Stocksbridge (Angela Smith).

I...

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 577 c465 (Link to this contribution)

I will take two interventions now, and then no more.

Stephen Lloyd | 577 c465 (Link to this contribution)

I appreciate that the figures are still high, but does my hon. Friend agree that a recent report ...

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 577 c465 (Link to this contribution)

I stand by the figures that I have just given.

Mark Pritchard | 577 c465 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend agree that animal welfare campaigners and farmers want to see healthy cattle ...

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 577 cc465-6 (Link to this contribution)

I will come on to vaccines.

I listened carefully to what my hon. Friend the Member for St A...

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 577 c466 (Link to this contribution)

I am reaching a conclusion.

FERA is doing work on sterilisation. Oral contraception has bee...

Russell Brown | 577 cc466-7 (Link to this contribution)

I rise in support of the motion. I congratulate colleagues on both sides of the House who tabled ...

Mark Harper | 577 c467 (Link to this contribution)

I take a particular interest because one of the cull areas covered a significant part of my const...

Russell Brown | 577 c467 (Link to this contribution)

I respect the hon. Gentleman, but his own Government, Ministers and the Secretary of State have d...

Emily Thornberry | 577 c467 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend agree that that shows the danger of Governments trying to be seen to be doing...

Russell Brown | 577 cc467-8 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention. Let us be honest: from time to time, we in this Cha...

Jim Cunningham | 577 c468 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend not agree that the Government entered into this with a preconceived idea abou...

Russell Brown | 577 c468 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for that intervention, which takes me back to the point made by my hon. Fr...

Martin Horwood | 577 c468 (Link to this contribution)

I agree with the hon. Gentleman that the badger cull was the wrong thing to do and that we should...

Baroness Primarolo | 577 c468 (Link to this contribution)

Order. Mr Brown, you are being very generous in giving way to other Members, but may I gently rem...

Russell Brown | 577 cc468-9 (Link to this contribution)

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I must say that I have been known to be generous to a fault on m...

Bill Wiggin | 577 c469 (Link to this contribution)

Unlike those of the previous speakers, my constituents have cattle. They also have experience of ...

Huw Irranca-Davies | 577 c469 (Link to this contribution)

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. The hon. Gentleman has mentioned once again the IEP re...

Baroness Primarolo | 577 c469 (Link to this contribution)

That is clearly not a matter for the Chair, but the Minister will have heard the hon. Gentleman’s...

Bill Wiggin | 577 cc469-470 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to you for your judgment, Madam Deputy Speaker. Unlike the shadow Minister, I do no...

Mark Harper | 577 c470 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to my hon. Friend and constituency neighbour for giving way. Given that we are talk...

Bill Wiggin | 577 c470 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is, as always, absolutely right.

Angela C Smith | 577 c470 (Link to this contribution)

Even if we do not have the IEP report, we know that the pilot culls took 11 weeks rather than the...

Bill Wiggin | 577 c470 (Link to this contribution)

I hope that the hon. Lady agrees that I have been generous in giving way to her, because she had ...

Caroline Lucas | 577 c470 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Bill Wiggin | 577 c470 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, I will give way, although I must not give way much more.

Caroline Lucas | 577 c470 (Link to this contribution)

The words that the hon. Gentleman has just spoken are scientifically so wrong. All the evidence t...

Bill Wiggin | 577 c471 (Link to this contribution)

I am delighted that the hon. Lady is so completely and utterly wrong. The joy of that is that the...

Bob Stewart | 577 c471 (Link to this contribution)

Very briefly, what does the chief veterinary officer for the Government suggest should happen?

Bill Wiggin | 577 c471 (Link to this contribution)

We would love to know. We would love to know what the Government think of the report, but we have...

Bill Wiggin | 577 c472 (Link to this contribution)

No.

Today’s debate is unworthy of a Division and I hope that the House will not divide unti...

Martin Horwood | 577 c472 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Bill Wiggin | 577 c472 (Link to this contribution)

No.

If the EU is going to ban our exports if we vaccinate, it should do so on proper health...

Barry Sheerman | 577 cc472-3 (Link to this contribution)

I shall be brief as I am the least expert person trying to catch Madam Deputy Speaker’s eye and I...

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown | 577 cc473-4 (Link to this contribution)

I am delighted, Madam Deputy Speaker, to catch your eye in this debate. I draw Members’ attention...

Mel Stride | 577 c474 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend also agree that we should learn lessons from other countries? The fact is the...

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown | 577 c474 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend brings me to the very last paragraph of my speech. In the Republic of Ireland, fro...

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown | 577 c474 (Link to this contribution)

I have a choice over whom to give way to.

Tracey Crouch | 577 c474 (Link to this contribution)

Is my hon. Friend also aware that Northern Ireland, which has never culled badgers and has no bad...

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown | 577 c474 (Link to this contribution)

Common sense and logic should say to my hon. Friend that a 50% reduction in the south must have a...

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown | 577 c475 (Link to this contribution)

I give way to the hon. Gentleman, but it will be the last intervention I take as we have been ask...

Albert Owen | 577 c475 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman talked about countries. Wales is a country within the United Kingdom, and in F...

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown | 577 cc475-6 (Link to this contribution)

I am not an expert on Wales, and I am sure that others who are situated in Wales will wish to spe...

Geoffrey Robinson | 577 c476 (Link to this contribution)

I speak in this debate very much as a layman. I am not a farmer or an expert on the scientific is...

Andy Sawford | 577 c476 (Link to this contribution)

I met farmers in my constituency to discuss the cull, and they did not believe that it would be e...

Geoffrey Robinson | 577 c477 (Link to this contribution)

I thoroughly agree and thank my hon. Friend for that apposite intervention.

The hon. Member...

Jim Cunningham | 577 c477 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend not think that there is sufficient evidence from Scotland showing how the vac...

Geoffrey Robinson | 577 c477 (Link to this contribution)

To be honest, I do not know. I have read as much as I can. But I do know from the evidence so far...

Andrew George | 577 cc477-8 (Link to this contribution)

It is a pleasure to contribute to a debate on this subject, as I have done on a number of occasio...

Bob Stewart | 577 c478 (Link to this contribution)

Is this debate not about the welfare of cattle, the welfare of badgers and the fact that this hor...

Andrew George | 577 c478 (Link to this contribution)

Absolutely. This is, of course, about the impact the disease has on a whole range of wildlife, in...

Mark Tami | 577 c478 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman talks about evidence, and I think that we all agree totally that that is the r...

Andrew George | 577 cc478-9 (Link to this contribution)

I am on the record as having cautioned the Government about the roll-out of the two pilot cull pr...

Susan Elan Jones | 577 c479 (Link to this contribution)

Whatever our views on this subject, one need only remember what the Secretary of State himself sa...

Andrew George | 577 c479 (Link to this contribution)

I think those who called for this debate were anticipating, or hoping, that the IEP report would ...

Andrew George | 577 c479 (Link to this contribution)

I will, but I am probably testing the patience of others.

Roger Williams | 577 c480 (Link to this contribution)

I respect my hon. Friend’s views on these matters, but does he agree that however poor the tuberc...

Baroness Primarolo | 577 c480 (Link to this contribution)

Mr George, it is not my patience you will be testing; it that of your colleagues who are patientl...

Andrew George | 577 c480 (Link to this contribution)

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker.

I will bring my remarks to a close by reminding people tha...

Jamie Reed | 577 cc480-1 (Link to this contribution)

While I have the Floor, I am sure that colleagues across the House would like to congratulate pup...

Simon Hart | 577 c481 (Link to this contribution)

It will be with a heavy heart that I will not vote on this motion, if there is a Division. I real...

Simon Hart | 577 c482 (Link to this contribution)

I have a huge amount of respect for the shadow Minister, as he knows. It is all very well for him...

Clive Efford | 577 c482 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Simon Hart | 577 cc482-3 (Link to this contribution)

Not at the moment, but I will in a short while.

This is a matter of great sensitivity. Alth...

Paul Flynn | 577 cc483-5 (Link to this contribution)

I think we should judge the contribution of the hon. Member for Carmarthen West and South Pembrok...

David Amess | 577 c485 (Link to this contribution)

I do not want to provoke my hon. Friend the Member for North Herefordshire (Bill Wiggin), but as ...

David Amess | 577 c486 (Link to this contribution)

Madam Deputy Speaker has given the impression that she does not welcome interventions, so I will ...

Daniel Kawczynski | 577 c486 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend mentioned that he represents an urban area. Will he agree to come to Shropshire to...

David Amess | 577 cc486-7 (Link to this contribution)

I am trying to keep within my eight or nine minutes, Madam Deputy Speaker. This is like when I ex...

Chris Williamson | 577 cc487-9 (Link to this contribution)

I congratulate the hon. Member for St Albans (Mrs Main) on securing this debate and the Backbench...

Andrew Turner | 577 c488 (Link to this contribution)

Would the hon. Gentleman mind looking at whether there is a difference in the policing costs for ...

Chris Williamson | 577 c488 (Link to this contribution)

Policing costs are a significant contributory factor to the overall cost of the badger cull, but ...

John McDonnell | 577 c488 (Link to this contribution)

Is it not important to acknowledge the distress the cull has caused to the wider community overal...

Chris Williamson | 577 c488 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is absolutely correct. That distress is not confined to people living in towns and...

Roger Williams | 577 cc488-490 (Link to this contribution)

For the avoidance of doubt, I declare an interest. I am responsible for some cattle in Wales and ...

Jim Cunningham | 577 c490 (Link to this contribution)

What the hon. Gentleman is saying is very interesting. Is he going to say anything about the effe...

Roger Williams | 577 cc490-1 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that correction. I shall come to the issue he has raised in a mome...

Lilian Greenwood | 577 c491 (Link to this contribution)

Does the hon. Gentleman not share my concern that whatever we think about the issue of culling, t...

Roger Williams | 577 c491 (Link to this contribution)

We await the report on that. We have had only leaked evidence and I have heard less critical inte...

Roger Williams | 577 c491 (Link to this contribution)

I will not give way as I have almost used up my time allowance.

Continuing results from the...

Jim Fitzpatrick | 577 cc491-2 (Link to this contribution)

I apologise for not being here at the start of the debate.

Along with a number of colleague...

Angela C Smith | 577 c492 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for giving way. I was named in the previous speech, but the hon. Member fo...

Jim Fitzpatrick | 577 c493 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend has set the record straight following the hon. Gentleman’s comments. I also congra...

Clive Efford | 577 c493 (Link to this contribution)

Many Members prayed in aid the fact that the report was delivered to the Secretary of State only ...

Jim Fitzpatrick | 577 cc493-4 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes a valid point. One of the successes of the Backbench Business Committee’s pr...

Tracey Crouch | 577 c494 (Link to this contribution)

It is a pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Poplar and Limehouse (Jim Fitzpatrick). I start by...

Daniel Kawczynski | 577 c494 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend says that she has been talking to her farmers in Kent. How much time has she spent...

Tracey Crouch | 577 cc494-6 (Link to this contribution)

I have not come to this conclusion lightly. My hon. Friend might recall that when I first spoke o...

Iain McKenzie | 577 cc496-8 (Link to this contribution)

I do not intend to use up all the time available to me, as I have contributed to the previous two...

Adrian Sanders | 577 cc498-500 (Link to this contribution)

As a Member of Parliament for a constituency in Devon, I am well aware of just how devastating bo...

Caroline Lucas | 577 cc499-502 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the Backbench Business Committee for granting time for the debate and the hon. Member for...

Charles Hendry | 577 c501 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Lady will be aware that there is a high-risk area in Sussex, which spreads broadly from ...

Caroline Lucas | 577 cc501-4 (Link to this contribution)

I welcome the hon. Gentleman’s intervention and completely agree. I know that in previous debates...

Daniel Kawczynski | 577 cc504-5 (Link to this contribution)

Of course, one comes across a lot of emotional issues with constituents, but in the nine years fo...

Nicholas Dakin | 577 cc505-6 (Link to this contribution)

I agree with the hon. Member for Shrewsbury and Atcham (Daniel Kawczynski) that we need to stop t...

Paul Burstow | 577 cc506-8 (Link to this contribution)

I very much welcome this debate. I congratulate the hon. Member for St Albans (Mrs Main) on takin...

Nia Griffith | 577 cc508-9 (Link to this contribution)

Tuberculosis infection is of major concern to our farming community. The distress that is caused ...

Neil Parish | 577 cc509-510 (Link to this contribution)

It is a great pleasure to speak in this debate.

It is far too early to draw conclusions fro...

Caroline Lucas | 577 c510 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Neil Parish | 577 cc510-1 (Link to this contribution)

I had to wait all afternoon to speak, so I do not think that I will give way.

We have tried...

Lord Stunell | 577 cc511-3 (Link to this contribution)

Hazel Grove is in the northern part of Cheshire or the southern part of Greater Manchester, and C...

Huw Irranca-Davies | 577 cc513-5 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the Backbench Business Committee for choosing the debate and the hon. Member for St Alban...

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown | 577 c515 (Link to this contribution)

Between 1998 and 2010, the number of herd breakdowns tripled from 1,226 to 3,334, and the number ...

Huw Irranca-Davies | 577 cc515-6 (Link to this contribution)

No, and I refer the hon. Gentleman, who makes a valid point, to the figures for the past three ye...

George Eustice | 577 c516 (Link to this contribution)

I begin by picking up on a point made by the hon. Member for Poplar and Limehouse (Jim Fitzpatric...

George Eustice | 577 c516 (Link to this contribution)

I will not give way. I want to carry on and make this point, because there were lots of issues ra...

George Eustice | 577 c516 (Link to this contribution)

No, I will not; I will keep going.

Bill Wiggin | 577 c517 (Link to this contribution)

On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. As DEFRA has not released its report, it would be demeani...

Lindsay Hoyle | 577 c517 (Link to this contribution)

You know very well, as I do, that if a Member shouts one way, they should not vote the other way,...

George Eustice | 577 c517 (Link to this contribution)

I want to say a little about what we have done to progress an oral vaccine. We are spending £1.6 ...

Andrew George | 577 c517 (Link to this contribution)

The Minister referred to the trials that were about to commence in the Penwith area with the supp...

George Eustice | 577 cc517-8 (Link to this contribution)

I expect my hon. Friend will do better next year.

As I said, we are spending £1.6 million a...

George Eustice | 577 c518 (Link to this contribution)

I am going to run out of time and I want to leave time for the hon. Member for St Albans (Mrs Mai...

George Eustice | 577 cc518-9 (Link to this contribution)

I am not going to give way, but I know what the hon. Lady is going to say.

We recognise tha...

Anne Main | 577 c519 (Link to this contribution)

I thank hon. Members on both sides of the House for their compassionate remarks in this important...

Huw Irranca-Davies | 577 c519 (Link to this contribution)

On a point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. Parliament has today expressed a very clear view that the...

Lindsay Hoyle | 577 c522 (Link to this contribution)

That is not a matter for me, as the hon. Gentleman is well aware, but I am sure that his point wi...

George Eustice | 577 c522 (Link to this contribution)

I will respond, Mr Deputy Speaker, because obviously the shadow Minister has an issue with the fa...

Baroness McIntosh of Pickering | 577 c522 (Link to this contribution)

Further to that point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. We have had a very well-mannered, even-handed ...

Lindsay Hoyle | 577 c522 (Link to this contribution)

I will be quite honest: I do not treat what you have said as a point of order. There is no record...

Angela Eagle | 577 c522 (Link to this contribution)

Further to that point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. This is now the second time the House has deba...

Lindsay Hoyle | 577 c522 (Link to this contribution)

I can understand that frustration is being shown at this time, but I am not in a position to offe...

Paul Flynn | 577 c522 (Link to this contribution)

Further to that point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker. You will be aware that this debate was followe...

Lindsay Hoyle | 577 c522 (Link to this contribution)

That is also not a point of order. It is a matter for the Government when and if they wish to hav...

Subjects
Animal welfare
Badgers
Cattle
Disease control
Pilot schemes
Standards
Vaccination
Bovine tuberculosis
Link
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