Scotland Bill

My Lords, almost everyone who is in the House now will recollect that when I last spoke at any length in Committee it was on the group led by Amendment 53. As I had expected that that group would be much bigger and would include my noble friend's amendments, I told the Committee that it was my intention to address those in anticipation. I had intended to restrict my remarks to referring your Lordships and my noble friend, in particular, to the speech I made earlier, but he has drawn so much support for his greater agenda from one part of that speech that I think I should pause for a few moments and remind him of what I said and the context in which I said it. It will then be open to him, of course, to draw any conclusions he chooses. I feel like a government Minister at this point, repeating words. I remember the shock when I said, in making a broader argument about the political circumstances that informed the decision that we needed to make on ordering our priorities in terms of a referendum—no doubt the Official Report will correct me if I am wrong —that, as the Calman commission noted, a mandate had at least partially been granted by the 1997 referendum on Scottish devolution. It was a partial mandate, in one part of a broader argument. I have probably gone further in explanation and beyond my prepared script than any Minister has in this House today. Perhaps I was unwise to do that. However, my noble friend is well able to read the rest of the context of that shortened quotation. If that gives him the comfort that he seeks—should there be any future Labour Government within a timescale that would allow him to resurrect his ambition for full fiscal autonomy—then I would be surprised. However, the noble Lord addressed his question to the Minister, and I am sure that the noble and learned Lord will be well able to respond. No doubt he will make his decision on whether to press his amendment on the basis of the ministerial response rather than mine. It should not surprise anybody who has witnessed any of these debates in Committee that we went long on the amendment before we got on to a much broader and wider subject and found ourselves debating full fiscal autonomy, devo-max and transfer of resources. Latterly, the noble Lord, Lord Maclennan of Rogart, reminded us that he is a federalist, and we had a debate about federalism. I am sure that noble Lords will appreciate it if I resist the temptation to have a debate about the second stage of the process of settling the devolution deal in the United Kingdom and continue to devote my resources to the first part of that process. The argument does not involve reminding the people of Scotland—as the noble Lord, Lord Forsyth, suggested—of the consequences of separation and independence, but reminding them of what they already know and instinctively feel, as recent polling shows, about the value of continuing to be part of the United Kingdom; and showing a way forward for shared prosperity, including through the transfer of resources. I am glad my noble friend Lord Sewel made his contribution to the debate. There are many aspects and strengths to being a citizen of the United Kingdom. One of the greatest strengths is the recognition that we do not all have the same advantages—because of where we are placed geographically—and the willingness to transfer resources to support each other in a common endeavour. It has been present almost all my life and I hope that it will continue for the rest of it.