Coroners and Justice Bill

The purpose of the amendment is to require the Secretary of State to appoint an independent commissioner for terrorist suspects. The commissioner would have two main functions. First, he would be able to monitor the detention and treatment of suspects detained under Section 41 of the Terrorism Act 2000. Secondly, he would act as the eyes and ears of the judge when the prosecution apply for an extension of time from seven days to 14 days and, ultimately, to 28 days under the provisions of Schedule 8. Eight months ago, in November 2008, I moved an almost identical amendment to the Counter-Terrorism Bill. That amendment was supported by the noble and learned Lord, Lord Mayhew, who I am glad to see in his place, the noble Viscount, Lord Colville of Culross, the noble Lord, Lord Dear, the noble Baroness, Lady Manningham-Buller, and many others, including the two opposition Front Benches. At the end of the debate, the noble Lord, Lord West, said that at first he had been minded to resist the amendment, but that, having listened to the debate, he would accept the amendment in substance, but needed more time to look at the wording. This Bill seemed to present a good opportunity to bring back the amendment before the Committee. I will remind the Committee of the benefits that will flow from the amendment, if it finds favour. I can do so briefly, because we went into it at some length last year. There are two main benefits. The first is that it will bring reassurance to members of the Muslim community—a point made very strongly on the previous occasion by the noble Baroness, Lady Falkner of Margravine. It comes about in this way. When terrorist suspects are arrested, often in circumstances of great publicity, and then released without charge after 28 days or whatever period it may be, it causes much resentment. It is resented, naturally, by the suspect himself. However, it is also resented by the suspect’s neighbours, and by the Muslim community at large. The presence of an independent commissioner at Paddington Green would do much to reassure the Muslim community, not just that the suspects are being well treated, as should surely go without saying, but also that the police are getting on with the investigation as quickly as they can. In other words, the community needs to be reassured that suspects are not being detained for a day longer than is absolutely necessary. The amendment that I am moving will be in accordance with recent government policy, which is to remove, so far as can be done, the causes of alienation among ethnic minorities. The policy sometimes goes under the name "Respect". I may be wrong about that, but I hope that the Minister, when he replies, will say at least that this idea comes within the general scope of that important policy. The second benefit flowing from the amendment is less obvious, but is equally important in the interests of justice. As the Committee knows, suspects are detained in the first instance for seven days. An application can then be made before a judge to extend the period to 14 and ultimately 28 days. As things stand, the judge has nothing to go on except what he is told by the prosecution. It is true that the suspect’s counsel may be present and can make submissions. However, neither the suspect himself nor his counsel will have access to the closed material; so counsel’s submissions on the point of whether there should be an extension will be based necessarily and to a large extent on guesswork. The advantage of having a commissioner is that, unlike counsel, he will have seen all the closed material in relation to all the suspects who are being investigated. He will be in a much better position than counsel to assist the judge by expressing an independent view on whether, for example, the police are getting on with the investigation as quickly as they should; or, to take another example, on whether the case against some of the suspects is so weak that they ought to be released at once. Since the commissioner will be present at the hearing of the application for an extension, he will be able to express his concerns to the judge and can be questioned by the judge about them. Of course, the prosecution will be able, so far as it can, to answer the concerns. I remember well, when we were asked to extend the detention period to 42 days, that a great deal was made of the fact that it would be a judge who made the decision on whether to extend the time. That was to be the great safeguard; but that safeguard is illusory unless the judge has heard both sides of the argument. That is the object of the amendment. There are only two arguments the other way. The first is a fear on the part of the police that it will hamper their investigation to have the commissioner present at Paddington Green. I do not understand their concern. The commissioner will be present during interviews at Paddington Green as an observer—nothing more. He will not stop the police conducting the investigation in any way that they may think appropriate. He will not stop them asking any questions that they want to ask. I hope that the Minister will explain why the police are so concerned, if indeed they are. The fear that the presence of the commissioner will hamper their investigation reminds me greatly of the fears that used to be expressed when it was first suggested that interviews should be recorded. Now the recording of interviews is seen as the most natural thing in the world: indeed, the police positively welcome it. The role of the commissioner being present at interviews will come to be seen in the same way. The second objection is on the ground of cost. It is said that the cost of a single commissioner at Paddington Green will be £50,000 a year. Is that not a small price to pay for ensuring that the judge gets all the help that he needs in making his important decision and for reassuring the Muslim community that suspects are not being held longer than is absolutely necessary? I beg to move.