Coroners and Justice Bill

I shall speak briefly in support of the amendment. I agree with every word said by the noble Baroness. I add what a pleasure it is to be on the same side as the noble and learned Lord, Lord Falconer of Thoroton, immediately after the last debate; it shows what a civilised place we are. I too had the opportunity to read the Written Ministerial Statement issued this afternoon by the Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice. I want to say how grateful I and all of us involved in the campaign have been for the assistance that we have had from Ministers and the conversations that have taken place. I appreciate the way in which the Government have listened and moved on the subject. I too applaud the decision that the categories of crime of genocide, war crimes and crimes against humanity should be included as from 1 January 1991. My only reservation, like the noble Baroness, is the Government’s apparent remaining indecision about the difference between presence and residence. I understand completely that the Government are still considering the matter, so I do not propose even to imply that they are resisting some significant change in the definition of persons who can fall within the expanded jurisdiction. I respectfully remind the Minister that a presence test exists in Canada, New Zealand, South Africa, France, Germany, Spain, Belgium and the United States for genocide. Indeed, if Senator Durbin’s Bill in the United States Congress is passed, as seems likely, there will be a presence test for crimes against humanity. Canada has a presence test across the board, and it has not caused particular difficulties there. My concern is that people who commit the most horrendous crimes against humanity, and have in some cases been guilty of the murder of hundreds of thousands of people, should have absolutely no hiding place. We would not be closing the loophole effectively if they were allowed to go shopping in Knightsbridge for a couple of days but were not liable to be arrested and tried here. It would continue the poor reputation that the United Kingdom has had as safe haven were there to be loopholes of that kind. Therefore, I simply urge the Minister in a spirit of co-operation that, when the matter comes back, a test should be found which perhaps excludes those whose plane perforce, by act of God or some other temporary reason, puts down at Heathrow Airport to be refuelled or repaired, but includes those who have chosen to remain here for a period of time.