Apprenticeships, Skills, Children and Learning Bill

I add my voice to the many who have praised the excellent work of Rathbone and Barnardo’s in helping young people who have sometimes chaotic backgrounds, as eloquently described by the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, and who might otherwise have trouble persuading employers to give them a chance into work. The benefits that many young people have derived from these schemes are beyond doubt. Our aim in legislating on apprenticeships has been to ensure a high-quality experience for apprentices and employers alike. We have rightly been scrutinised closely in this House and in another place so that we do nothing to dilute the apprenticeship brand, which is critical for maintaining the credibility of apprenticeships in the eyes of young people and business. At the heart of the statutory framework that we are proposing is a requirement for an apprenticeship agreement between the employer and apprentice which will set out the responsibilities and expectations on both sides. Paid employment is a fundamental part of this agreement. If I had to part company with the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, it was perhaps when she said it did not matter about paid employment—I might be paraphrasing slightly. We would say that it does, but I shall return to why I understand her reasons for saying that. We see paid employment as a fundamental part of an apprenticeship agreement. If we depart from that principle, we should be clear about the circumstances and why we are doing it. Any derogation from this central requirement risks undermining the strong employment relationship between apprentice and employer which we see as being key to providing a high-quality, transferable, on-the-job experience. Indeed, the previous group of amendments focused on concerns about the sections of the Bill which provide for regulations to be made so that an apprenticeship can be recognised for those working otherwise than for reward. However, we have listened to the debate. I am sympathetic to the intention behind the amendments. I recognise that many young people engaged in the programmes offered by Rathbone, Barnardo’s and others progress to an employed apprenticeship part way through their training. I understand the intention behind the amendments to ensure that young people in this position are issued with an apprenticeship certificate under Clause 2. We would not wish further to disadvantage those young people or to discourage them from aspiring to take up an apprenticeship place. The noble Baroness, Lady Garden, said that the last thing that we would want is for people to be left in a benefit trap, which does not benefit the individual or society. We are motivated strongly to do something to help those young people, especially when, as the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, described to us, apprenticeships prove to be such a life-changing opportunity for so many disadvantaged young people already. Like her, I have encountered numerous cases that demonstrate that. I want to ensure that we strike an appropriate balance. My officials are already in discussion with representatives from Rathbone and Barnardo’s. With noble Lords’ agreement, I should like to give this issue more detailed consideration and to come back to it on Report. That is a genuine commitment. We share the concerns expressed on all sides of the Committee that we have to do something about this situation. With that assurance, I ask the noble Baroness to withdraw the amendment.