Marine and Coastal Access Bill [HL]

This is an important group. Clearly, we want IFCAs to be successful in terms of having the right balance and ensuring that decisions are informed by the need to respect that balance. Having members from a variety of different backgrounds who know what they are doing is clearly very important indeed. One of the key advantages of the change between the current sea fisheries committees and the inshore fisheries and conservation authorities will be the balance of membership. The new statutory membership requirements will ensure that there is the correct balance of members on each authority so that they can deliver their new duties effectively, while taking account of local circumstances. It is our clear intention that there will be a statutory seat on each inshore fisheries and conservation authority for the Environment Agency, the MMO and Natural England. This will be set out in the secondary legislation that sets up each inshore fisheries and conservation district and authority. It is not included in the Bill—although I well understand why noble Lords were keen to see that happen—in order to provide flexibility should the name or nature of these organisations change. We will also set out in the secondary legislation setting up each inshore fisheries and conservation authority the maximum number of local authority members that there can be on that inshore fisheries and conservation authority. Our intention is that this will be up to one third. I want to make it clear that if that means that there are 10 relevant local authorities, it follows that the local authority membership will be 10 and that the total number on the committee will be of the order of 30. Taking the three statutory appointments, that leaves approximately 27 people to be appointed. That is the thinking behind our intention. We do not want to exclude local authorities; we see that it is important that the relevant local authorities are represented. In a sense, that sets out the marker for the composition of the committee. Clearly, if we went for the sixth option in the paper, there would be more local authority membership on the authority, and there would be other members as well. There is a balance, and one can see arguments both ways on that. Clause 147(2)(a) requires members appointed by the MMO to comprise those with fishing and marine environmental knowledge or expertise. MMO appointments to each inshore fisheries and conservation authority will be made according to the particular economic, social and environmental needs of that inshore fisheries and conservation authority. The detail of the appointment process will be drafted in guidance on which my department will consult this year. That will include information on how the MMO should decide on the balance of interests to be appointed. The guidance will stress the need for the balance of members to enable the inshore fisheries and conservation authorities effectively to deliver their new statutory duties. This will require there to be a balance of expertise that includes both fisheries and environmental interests. I very much take the point raised by the noble Earl, Lord Cathcart, about having members with scientific expertise. I should have thought that when one thinks about those with marine environmental knowledge, one would expect people with scientific expertise to be appointed. With the appointments by the MMO, Natural England and the Environment Agency, I should be very surprised if people with a scientific background and expertise were not appointed to these organisations. In a sense, we begin to see some of the advantage of the new approach, which balances expertise in the marine area, appropriate fishing representatives, commercial interests’ representatives, local authority representatives and the statutory bodies. That does not mean to say that they are going to find it easy to come to a balanced view, but at least the right people will be around the table. We do not think that it is appropriate to specify that there should be equal numbers of fishing and environmental members. The MMO should appoint the most appropriate members, depending on local circumstances and need. Some members may have fishing and environmental expertise, so it would not be practical or appropriate to attempt to make an equal split of members. However, the fact is that each IFCA will be the subject of its own order and, therefore, be subject to appropriate parliamentary scrutiny. Amendment A228B proposes that some of the MMO appointees must be persons acquainted with the needs and opinions of the fishing "communities" of the district, rather than "community", as the current wording proposes. The noble Lord, Lord Wallace, made a relevant point in relation to that, a point which was well taken. My understanding from the advice that I have received is that "community" is used in the wider sense to include any relevant "communities". Of course, I well take the noble Lord’s point that there are many different interests and, as has been pointed out in relation to the west country, different coastlines could be covered by the same IFCA. We will very much take the noble Lord’s point on board, but the legislation does not get in the way of that issue. The noble Earl, Lord Cathcart, has tabled amendments, but he has indicated that the Government have put down amendments which we hope will deal with this matter. We addressed the concern that the clause as drafted could allow the Secretary of State to vary or remove the descriptions of persons currently set out in subsection (2)(a) and (b)—that is, those appointed by the Marine Management Organisation. This issue was raised by the Delegated Powers Committee during its consideration of the Bill. This was not the intention of the clause, so we propose to amend the wording by introducing government amendment A230 whereby the Secretary of State would have a power to vary or remove only anything that is added to subsection (2) rather than a power to amend what is currently in subsection (2)(a) and (b). Subsection (2)(a) and (b) will not be able to be varied or removed by the Secretary of State as these descriptions will always be appropriate for inshore fisheries conservation authority appointees, but it is useful to retain a power for the Secretary of State to add new descriptions of persons, and to vary or remove those descriptions in future. Therefore, we think that we have dealt with the point raised by the Delegated Powers Committee, but we have the flexibility we need for future appointments that might need to be made. On that basis, we do not think that the order should be taken through the affirmative resolution procedure. I hope that I have answered the point sufficiently and that noble Lords will recognise that the Government, in bringing forward their own amendment, have considered very carefully the comments of the Delegated Powers Committee and the noble Earl, Lord Cathcart.