Marine and Coastal Access Bill [HL]

I am grateful to all noble Lords who have spoken in this interesting debate, and of course to the noble Baroness, Lady Hooper, for the amendments which she tabled and to which she spoke so eloquently. She will have derived a great deal of encouragement from the anticipated support she has had from all sides of the House. I know that noble Lords take the issue of our heritage—our marine heritage in this context—very seriously. The Bill spans a great deal of policy as well as a vast area of sea. The Government intend the marine policy statement and marine plans to address the interests and concerns of all those who are connected with the sea. Protecting our marine historic environment is important in our management of the marine environment more generally. We have ensured protection for these aspects within our high level marine objectives, which we issued for consultation last summer. These objectives will underpin the development of the marine policy statement which will then be applied in more detail in specific areas via marine plans. In response to the points put forward with his usual precision by my noble friend Lord Howarth, while there will be a number of national policy statements that we cannot pre-empt at this stage, I put it on the record that the marine policy statement will indeed set out the Government’s policy on safeguarding the marine environment, which will include cultural and historic marine heritage. Those documents will then drive decisions made in the marine area, so I hope that the Committee will appreciate that heritage protection will in a very real sense feature in decisions that are made. Of course, the Government are committed to sustainability. In response to my noble friend Lord Howarth this embraces the concept of the historic as well as the natural environment. The purpose of the nature conservation proposals in the Marine and Coastal Access Bill is to protect the natural environment. We have concluded that history and archaeology are very specialised areas of policy requiring equally specialised provisions. That is why we have been drafting a new heritage protection Bill. I make this point in response to a number of noble Lords who have spoken, the most recent of whom was the noble Baroness, Lady Byford. We have been unable to give the heritage protection Bill space in this Session’s legislative programme. The Government regret that, in the current economic climate, there are other pressing priorities, but we will bring that Bill forward as soon as parliamentary time allows. Defra has worked with the Department for Culture, Media and Sport to ensure that the Bill we are now considering enables us to provide adequate protection for the marine historic environment. I am grateful that the noble Baroness, Lady Hooper, has introduced Amendment 89L. It gives us a chance to air these important issues and for me to give some reassurance that they form part of the Government’s marine planning, which is the basis of this Bill. Amendment 89L relates to the matters that the marine plan authority must keep under review while exercising its planning functions. As stated in the Bill, they include physical, environmental, social, cultural and economic characteristics. I listened carefully to both the noble Lady and my noble friend Lord Howarth, who said that this list was not precise enough, although ““social, cultural and economic”” seems sufficiently broad to encompass the issues that they address with their amendments. The list of things that Clause 52 requires the planning authority to keep under review is indeed broad. It is certainly broad enough to include matters of historical and archaeological interest, without specific mention in the legislation. If it will help, I am happy to put it on record that we firmly intend that issues of historical and archaeological interest should be considered and addressed in marine plans. As the noble Lord, Lord Chorley, asked in his contribution, why is the list of objectives not more specific about cultural and—in particular—archaeological or historic matters? I think my noble friend Lord Judd also reflected on this. We intend to address those issues in much greater detail in due course, and to answer all noble Lords’ questions on these matters. However, I emphasise that this Bill does not exclude the important considerations that noble Lords have brought to the attention of the House this afternoon. There will be very few cases where there will be a risk that designating a marine conservation zone might have an adverse impact on marine heritage. We do not consider, given the range of consultations that are necessary and the objectives that the authorities must follow, that this Bill is anything except benign and constructive with regard to these significant issues. Amendments 106CA and 106CB seek to add the protection of historic and cultural heritage, as well the conservation of cultural significance, to the reasons for marine conservation zone-designations, which are set out in Clause 114. I understand the pressure for this from noble Lords and have some sympathy for the thrust of the amendment. I have already alluded to the need for specialised provisions to protect adequately our marine heritage. The same is true of marine nature conservation. The Bill sets out a system of protective measures specifically designed for natural environment conservation purposes. I consider that the results that we want in these two areas of policy do not overlap sufficiently for us to be able to use exactly the same tools for both. That is why we intend to bring the heritage protection Bill before Parliament in due course. That does not alter the fact that the protection of historic and cultural heritage is an important part of the work of this Bill. The noble Lord, Lord Tyler, spoke eloquently on the issues of Amendment 106A, which seeks to include natural beauty in the grounds for designating marine conservation zones. We will have a chance to debate that later when we look at the conservation of visual beauty in Part 5 of the Bill. I recognise that the noble Lord has located the amendment in this group for the purpose of supporting the general issues of cultural heritage. On the question of statutory consultees, who could disagree with the objective of this amendment? It seeks to ensure that the relevant expert advice is taken into account when making certain decisions. We agree with that point and have drafted the Bill to ensure that it happens. However, there is a problem with including lists of statutory consultees in the Bill. Our approach is, rather, to require the bodies taking decisions to consult all those people who are likely to take an interest in, or be affected by, these decisions. That should be clear. We expect to issue guidance, where appropriate, to indicate whom bodies should normally consider consulting when taking decisions. Where the marine historic environment is relevant to a decision, that guidance will say that obvious experts in marine heritage, such as English Heritage, should be consulted. I particularly appreciate the sharpness with which my noble friend Lord Howarth presented the point that unless people or organisations are listed, they can be overlooked. He will forgive me if I say that, within the framework of the Bill, we are certainly making sure that there is provision for our cultural and historic heritage. If we look in that framework at the marine environment and marine heritage, it is unthinkable that consultation could take place without English Heritage having its full opportunity for consultation. This approach will be quite as effective as lists of consultees. After all, the problem with lists of consultees—I am not for a moment suggesting this in the context of English Heritage—is that they go out of date because bodies change their names or designation. We are making provision in the Bill for the objectives that the noble Baroness, Lady Hooper, brought to our attention in her initial amendment. We will certainly ensure that English Heritage will be consulted wherever aspects of the marine conservation zones and marine plan are developed that affect anything to do with our heritage at sea. I give way to my noble friend.