Human Fertilisation and Embryology Bill [HL]

My Lords, I wonder if I might delay the House slightly to make two points in particular. I am moved to speak by the use of the word ““sinister”” by the noble Baroness, Lady Knight of Collingtree. I repeat something that I have said many times: I thank the noble Baroness for raising these issues, as she has consistently over the years, in order to bring them to the attention of your Lordships’ House and the public. However, there is a difference this evening. Listening to the contributions, one would be forgiven for forming the view that there has been some kind of conspiracy between the scientific community and the Government. That is not so. Noble Lords should remember that the noble Lord, Lord Patel raised these matters in your Lordships’ House in Committee and on Report. Fourteen Members of your Lordships’ House, including the noble Baroness, Lady O’Cathain, the noble Lord, Lord Alton, and the right reverend Prelate the Bishop of St Albans, took part in that discussion. We are suffering to an extent from a very partial portrayal of the events that have led up to this moment. There is partiality in that people have forgotten that this House and another place spent a considerable time—not only in their Chambers but in a Joint Committee—looking at the issue of consent when the Mental Capacity Act was going through. There was detailed consultation on that matter with a wide range of bodies, ranging from the Catholic Church to disability organisations. They were specifically asked about that issue. It was the considered opinion of another place and your Lordships’ House that, with very strong and explicit caveats and safeguards, people who lack capacity should, in certain circumstances, be able to take part in research. I well remember Members of your Lordships’ House who have a disability talking movingly about the need to make sure that people who lack the capacity to make some decisions should still be allowed to decide to take part in medical research. The other partiality this evening is the proposal that the Government said emphatically on 21 January that they would consider this no further. That is not true. The noble Lord, Lord Neill of Bladen, read out an extensive excerpt of what the noble Baroness, Lady Royall, said that night. She also said that she heard the sentiments in this House and would take these matters away for further consideration. It is for the noble Baroness, Lady Thornton, to explain the Government’s thinking to us. I happen to agree with Members of this House who think that the processes in another place are deficient. I agree that there has been a lack of scrutiny by elected Members, but I do not believe that it has been to the degree that has been indicated this evening or that there has been some kind of conspiracy. I return to my original point: it is not a matter of being sinister. In fact, the scientific community raised these issues. They raised the issue of the existing stem cell bank. They raised the issues of children who lack capacity and have life-limiting diseases to the extent that they will not reach adulthood. They raised the question of adults with mental capacity issues. Why? Because they wanted those issues to be brought before Parliament and for legislation to be properly formed. When we come to make our decision on this, we should do so in a way that sets out the proper background to the point we are at.