I, too, thank the Minister for his well intentioned and well received attempts to meet the concerns expressed by a number of noble Lords. Despite what I heard from the noble and learned Lord, Lord Mayhew, I still feel that the phrasing of Amendment No. 47 better reflects what one would like to see happening than the amendment tabled by the Government. Taking the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Judd, we are still talking about children and young people. The main aim is that they are treated as such, whether we are thinking about prevention, paying back to society or whatever. They come from the most deprived backgrounds, whether they have been subjected to ill treatment or just to inadequate treatment and parenting. It was, above all, the comments made by my noble friend Lady Stern that made one concentrate on this issue.
The very fact that that huge number of children, some as young as 13 or 15, should be serving indeterminate sentences, which may be short in theory but are likely to continue for a considerable time, is horrifying. We also know from reports by the Chief Inspector of Prisons about growing concern about self-harming. In 2004-05, there were approximately 25 incidents per week of children self-harming. That is not sensible; it is not the right way to be dealing with children and young persons, so I hope that we can look at this again.
Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill
Proceeding contribution from
Baroness Howe of Idlicote
(Crossbench)
in the House of Lords on Wednesday, 2 April 2008.
It occurred during Debate on bills on Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill.
Type
Proceeding contribution
Reference
700 c1057 
Session
2007-08
Chamber / Committee
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