I wonder if I could expand this point just a little further. We have no control over guidance, particularly if it is not before us on Report. The only thing that we can control is the wording that appears in the statute. Guidance is not regulation so we do not even have that in our quiver to consider for a later stage. Anything could go into guidance. That is my first point.
My second point is that the Minister has to consider how these things work in practice. The person who applies for the order obviously wants to get that order. Therefore, he has to brief himself not only on the terms of the Act, but, if the Minister is right, on the guidance. He will have to be ready to satisfy the guidance notes before the magistrate. That is just the same thing as if it was in the Bill, but at least we would all know where we are. Then the matter goes before the court and the people opposing the making of the order have to look, again, not just at what is in the Bill but at the issues that arise on the guidance. We are always looking at two separate documents: what the Bill says on the point, which is the basis of the order; and the guidance—it has no statutory basis at all, as the noble Lord, Lord Campbell of Alloway, pointed out—which has to be kept to one side and consulted for any order to be made. This is totally confusing.
I cannot see anything in the Minister’s reply about it being complex to put the matters which we have raised in the Bill. I hope that he will consider before Report the criticisms that have been made from all around the Committee—if the noble Lord, Lord Judd, were here I am sure he would be criticising the provision too—so that something can be done by Report which will satisfy the problems we have discussed.
Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill
Proceeding contribution from
Lord Thomas of Gresford
(Liberal Democrat)
in the House of Lords on Monday, 10 March 2008.
It occurred during Committee of the Whole House (HL)
and
Debate on bills on Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill.
Type
Proceeding contribution
Reference
699 c1313 
Session
2007-08
Chamber / Committee
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