Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill

I am most grateful to the Minister for his reply, and to all noble Lords who spoke in this short and very revealing debate. These amendments have not only occurred to the Opposition. Rather, their underlying views are extremely powerfully advocated by the Standing Committee for Youth Justice. I am a little unclear, given the Minister’s response, about exactly what motivation lies behind the Government’s approach. On the one hand, the Minister has said that the situation has now changed because we have Clause 1 of the Bill and this generic youth rehabilitation order, which takes a new approach to the youth justice system. Consequently, it is necessary to review the scope of the courts’ discretion in dealing with breaches. On the other hand, there have a number of occasions when Ministers, in the context of the Bill generally and in the context of this clause in particular, have said that one of the reasons for it is the need to maintain confidence in community sentences. That is an entirely different point. I should like to hear the Minister’s response to that, if he cares to get on his feet again. The Minister drew my attention to a number of other provisions in the Bill, suggesting that in fact the change is rather marginal. Is he saying that what I am seeking, and what the Standing Committee for Youth Justice is seeking, is in fact in the Bill anyway if you read all the measures in conjunction? If that is so, why do the Government not simply accept our amendments or say that our amendments are actually what the Bill says? My concern is that of course there will be situations when a breach comes before a magistrate or a judge and that magistrate or judge will say, ““Actually, the original cocktail of measures under the youth rehabilitation order is not suitable and we will have to refine them””. Equally, he may take a completely different view. He may take the view that the original range of dispositions under the order were exactly right and the reasons why the young man or woman had not been able to comply 100 per cent were either out of their control or understandable in their social circumstances. It is that second thing that the judge can no longer do. He is the only person who will have a real grasp of what the situation on the ground is like; so why on earth remove that discretion from him? I do not know whether the Minister wants to respond.