Criminal Justice and Immigration Bill

There has been unanimity of view until now, when it is my turn to speak. This has been a short but interesting debate. The noble Earl, Lord Onslow, asked why we did not trust the professionals. I am a great admirer and rereader of the text of the noble Baroness, Lady O'Neill, for the Dimbleby lecture five or six years ago, which was on the theme of putting our trust in professionals and of the dangers of not doing that. As a general proposition, I very much agree with it. Equally, there is always a balance to be drawn between the role of Parliament and government in setting a framework and what then has to happen at local level. We will argue, throughout the Bill, I suspect, about whether we get the balance right. As a general comment rather than specific to this debate, my experience as a Minister is that, collectively, parliamentarians are concerned about too much central diktat, but then spend most of their efforts putting pressure on the Government to do something. It is difficult to get the balance right. Indeed, some of the amendments tabled by noble Lords who argue for discretion in this area are very precise in another area. On the specific points raised by the noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, there is a safeguarding in paragraph 3(1) of Schedule 2, which states: "““If the responsible officer is of the opinion that the offender has failed without reasonable excuse””." Together with the guidelines that will be established, that gives sufficient discretion for the responsible officer to make a common-sense judgment in this area. The court is then given discretion in the ways that it can deal with the breach. It has to deal with it, but there are various options in paragraph, 6 and likewise in paragraph 8 in relation to the Crown Court. I would argue that we have established the right balance. The noble Lord, Lord Kingsland, argued that, under the current community sentencing arrangements, courts can choose not to do anything in response to a breach that is brought before them. That is a fair point to make. But we believe that under the new framework that we are debating, doing nothing, or at least doing nothing without reviewing the order, should not be an option. As I said, the specified actions for courts to take provide for a range of options for the court when dealing with a breach while taking into account how the young offender has complied with the existing order. The new youth rehabilitation order has many different requirements. It is different from the current framework, which is sentence-driven. In the current circumstances it may well be right for a court to allow a young person to continue with a supervision order or an action plan order where this has been breached because, in many cases, the sentence does not have the potential to contain multifaceted requirements such as can be attached to the youth rehabilitation order. In the Government’s view, where a youth rehabilitation order is breached, the requirements need to be reviewed and revised where necessary and appropriate. We believe that it should be reviewed to ascertain whether the requirements originally attached were best suited to the young person. Requirements may need to be substituted or amended. Indeed, the court can take no action under the third power that has been set out in paragraph 6(2)(c), and paragraph 8(2)(c). Paragraph 6(2)(c) states that the court can deal with the offender, "““in any way in which the court could have dealt with the offender for that offence””." It means that the court could make a youth rehabilitation order less onerous by taking away a requirement that is not appropriate. I accept the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Kingsland. Some young people will find the requirements attached to the youth rehabilitation order difficult to comply with. When it is breached, it is right for the court to consider properly whether the original requirements were appropriate and whether they should continue. The youth rehabilitation order will be effective only if it is properly tailored to the needs of the individual. A breach of the YRO could be a clear indication that this aspiration has not been fulfilled. We would not want to perpetuate requirements that, in practice, are not working or suitable. The courts should be able to review and revise a youth rehabilitation order where it is breached. Overriding that is the whole construct of youth rehabilitation orders as part of a programme designed to ensure that custody is truly a last resort. It is about a robust community sentencing framework. We have to make it clear that breaches cannot be tolerated. There are sufficient safeguards in the Bill, which is why I hope the House will accept the provisions as they are currently enunciated.