Employment Bill [HL]

I support the amendment, which is in my name and that of my noble friends. A number of speakers have made the point that there does not seem to be any point in raising this matter in the context of this Bill. I know quite well a number of people who serve as wing persons or lay members on arbitration tribunals, and they are very concerned about what the future holds for them. Of course, there is a government consultation paper, which gives them some concern, and I am not surprised because, according to that paper, all tribunals are being considered. There seems to be a view that all tribunals are the same and that their members are somehow interchangeable. Moreover, there is a quote in the consultation paper from the recent Gibbons review of tribunals to the effect that retired members sitting on tribunals might not always have up-to-date, current work experience; and on the other hand individuals who are currently in employment might have difficulty getting time off to do tribunal work. One way or another, either retired people or people at work who are lay members are apparently not to be considered as suitable to sit on tribunals. That, of course, has made people very concerned. Another thing that is causing them concern is the apparent reduction in the number of cases heard by full tribunals in favour of tribunal cases heard by a judge sitting alone. That again gives them the feeling that perhaps they are being phased out. The trade unions certainly do not want that to happen, because they have always supported the tripartite setup. The unions believe that the lay people who serve on tribunals offer necessary support, and they give the impression to those who appear before them that they are making their case to members who know what they are talking about. That is not always the case with purely legally qualified people—often they do not have that kind of knowledge. I make an exception in the case of my noble friend because I know that he has both a legal and business background. But that is not generally the case by any means, which is why the lay people are so necessary and important. I therefore hope that the Government will give serious consideration to the proposal. It is a serious concern held by people who are doing good work. I support the amendment.