Government of Wales Bill

We come now to an important part of the consideration of part 3 in respect of Assembly Measures. As we pointed out briefly on Second Reading, the problem concerning the Assembly Measures procedure is that it is a way of getting around the necessity of holding a referendum to give primary legislative power to the Welsh Assembly. As we explained and is our view, while there may be arguments for or against giving primary legislative power to the Welsh Assembly, that is a matter for the people of Wales to determine if they so wish and a referendum is the essential precondition for doing that. The problem of the route that appears to commend itself to the Government and that is contained in part 3 is that it envisages achieving roughly the same outcome by a mechanism that does not require a referendum and does not give primary legislative power to the Welsh Assembly. It allows the Welsh Assembly to enact Orders in Council, which are equivalent in scope to primary legislation. We exist in this House to scrutinise legislation. We may not do it as well as we should. Guillotines, lack of time and a host of other problems, some of them archaic procedure, do not lend themselves to our always doing it properly. Nevertheless, the process of a Bill—the process on which we are embarked this afternoon—is important. We are here not just to pass principles of legislation but, normally, to look at its detail. As most of us know, the process by which we examine the detail of legislation, if people are prepared to bother to come into the Chamber, sit, listen and participate, can improve legislation. The people who go up to the Committee corridors and listen to a Standing Committee are often pleasantly surprised to note the spirit in which the debate is conducted and sometimes the willingness of the Government to accept proposals.