Government of Wales Bill

Yes, the preliminary draft measure, along with its explanatory memorandum, will be attached. It will therefore, going through its pre-legislative scrutiny, be amendable. My right hon. Friend the Member for Torfaen expressed concern that it could not be amended. In its preliminary draft form, when it was going through the pre-legislative scrutiny process, it could be amended. Once the process has been completed, it would go back to the Assembly for the wording of the order to be confirmed. It would come before my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State, who would lay the Order in Council. We would then have an hour and a half debate on the Floor of the House, if required. The usual channels would decide how it would work. The important thing, which the Conservative party cannot accept, is that the detail of the legislation that would be proposed and to which permission would be given by this House would be scrutinised by the Assembly. We are getting rather a spurious argument. The Tories have not changed that much and they do not want further powers devolved down to the Assembly for it to scrutinise its own legislation. There is no fundamental change to the devolution settlement. Parliament remains in pole position. As many hon. Members will know, we are already giving framework powers to the National Assembly for Wales. For example, in relation to the NHS Redress Bill the Assembly will be given framework powers to develop its own scheme. Under that Bill, the Assembly will decide its own regulations on a complete smoking ban in Wales. Those processes are ongoing. Our aim in the Orders in Council process is to overcome the parliamentary legislative logjam and to fast-track Welsh legislation. It is certainly not a back-door mechanism; it is open and transparent, unlike the present procedures. The Assembly may want a piece of legislation to be passed, but it is up the Secretary of State and various Committees in this place and in government to decide whether it becomes part of our legislative programme. Let me assure my right hon. Friend the Member for Swansea, West, who is no longer in his place, that there was widespread consultation on the White Paper and that the Parliament Act cannot be used in relation to Orders in Council. The hon. Member for Brecon and Radnorshire (Mr. Williams) compared the process in the Bill with the Northern Ireland process, but, as I am sure he now accepts after my explanation, they are not alike. The detail of the Orders in Council under the Bill will be scrutinised by the Assembly. Another issue that exercised hon. Members on both sides of the House is that of dual candidacy. The hon. Member for Caernarfon (Hywel Williams) and other hon. Members quoted the Welsh Affairs Committee report and the evidence given to that Committee, but having read that report I have to say, in all humility, that I saw no evidence that the Labour party is being partisan; what I saw was opinions expressed by academics and others. In fact, evidence presented by other academics argued strongly that dual candidacy was a real issue.