My Lords, I start by reminding noble Lords of my entry in the register. This has been a fascinating opener for this afternoon’s proceedings. I know that this is an area of great importance to this House. I want to take account of the concerns raised in the debate and more clearly show our intention on this issue. Perhaps I should start by saying that, having been in, then out and now back in Defra over about a decade or more—and not being a scientist—I absolutely do take the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Krebs. I try never to use the words that the noble Lord, Lord Winston, attributed to me, which was that I was following the science. The science is imprecise, and what we have to do as policy- makers is take a view, listen to reputable people who advise us and organisations both here and around the world, and hope we get it right.
I shall say just two things at this stage of the proceedings on what my involvement in the Bill is not about. First, to tackle what the noble Baroness, Lady Bennett of Manor Castle, said—that this is somehow to satisfy the demands of the global agricultural corporations—no, it is not that. As far as I know, we have had no lobbying from any of those organisations, and this is about something else which I shall come to. Secondly, it is not about taking back control. For me, it is about looking at crops that I see frying in heatwaves that we never had when I was younger. It is about talking to farmers who have Belgian Blue cattle that can give birth to calves only by Caesarean section because they have been bred through traditional breeding methods in a way that makes natural calving impossible. It is about correcting some of those aberrations that have existed, as well pointed out by the noble Lord, Lord Trees. We can tie ourselves down with negativity about this, but the opportunities for this legislation, what it offers for animal welfare and for tackling issues such as climate change, are immense.
On the amendment to remove animals from the Bill completely, as was highlighted in Committee and in today’s debate, I say that it is vital that animals remain
part of the Bill. We focused on farmed animals in debate because there is already research in the UK and abroad showing the exciting potential of precision breeding to help tackle some of the most pressing challenges to our food system, the environment and animal welfare. These challenges are significant, and while these technologies are not a silver bullet, they can work alongside other approaches to help us to improve animal health and welfare, enhance the sustainability of farming, and strengthen food security and resilience. It is vital that we create an enabling regulatory environment to translate the research that we have already highlighted in debates into practical, tangible benefits.
It is equally vital that these technologies are used responsibly. That is why we have included specific measures in the Bill to safeguard animal welfare. These go beyond what is required for traditional breeding and under current GMO requirements. We therefore do not see this legislation as a route to lowering welfare standards. Instead, we see it as a real opportunity to improve animal welfare and our food system.
The debate about outliers was fascinating. As a policymaker, I quite like challenging Defra scientists and those who advise us by pushing an outlying piece of science, something that may not even be peer-reviewed. It is one of my criticisms of the scientific lobby that, to get peer-reviewed papers, you have to be in the centre. In this case, I have looked at the broad range of views in the scientific community. I entirely endorse the sentiments put forward by the noble Lord, Lord Krebs. However, I understand concerns raised in the debate about the use of precision-breeding technologies in certain groups of animals, such as companion animals, and I recognise and agree with noble Lords on the importance of building confidence in the regulatory system.
There is a case for prioritising where there is the greatest research interest and where there are greatest potential benefits for animal welfare in our food system. That is why I want to make a commitment on the Floor of this House that we will adopt a phased approach to commencing the measures in the Bill in relation to animals. In other words, we will commence the measures in the Bill for only a select group of animal species in the first instance before commencing them in relation to other species. For example, in the first phase it is likely to be animals typically used in agriculture or aquaculture.
As indicated during Committee, we intend to use the commencement powers within the Bill to achieve that. These powers allow us to bring the provisions in the Bill into force in relation to a specific list of species or group of animals; for example, we can apply the provisions to cattle by stating the species name as Bos taurus—domestic cows. That means that until the relevant commencement regulations applicable to them are made, some species or groups of animals, such as companion animals, will not be affected by changes in the Bill. Likewise, GMO rules would continue to apply to them if they are produced using precision-breeding technology. Taking this approach allows us to limit the practical effect of the Bill for a time, while retaining the flexibility and durability needed to capture the potential benefits in other species in the future.
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I question the point raised by my noble friend Lady McIntosh that there seems to be great opposition to this. Of course, it depends on the question asked, but we know that public levels of understanding are low, and that public sentiment is more in favour particularly if the use is associated with a benefit. For example, FSA research last year found that 54% of people think it would be acceptable to use the precision breeding of plants in food production, while just 16% say that it would be unacceptable. A BEIS survey from 2019 found that 63% of participants supported the use of precision breeding for disease-resistant crops, 65% for crops resistant to adverse weather, and a similar number for an increase in health benefits in fruit and veg. I know that we are talking about animals, but it is worth pointing out that there is public acceptance of much of what we are talking about.
As I said, the priority for the first phase would be animal species that are typically used in agriculture and aquaculture. We would like to gather and consider further evidence and continue our engagement with key experts before we define the full list of species we intend to introduce first.
If it helps the noble Baroness, Lady Hayman, I think that this answers her point: if the Bill passes, plant commencement regulations would come forward in 2024, but I do not foresee, unless science moves at a particularly rapid rate, that plants would be ready for market for four to five years from Royal Assent. I suspect animals to be two to three years after that, so significantly beyond—if I got it right—the date that she mentioned. I do not want to restrict this or future Governments; I do not want to restrict the benefits that could accrue from this technology if suddenly, as the noble Lord, Lord Krebs, mentioned, a particular area of work could be brought forward that would be of huge benefit.
Before the measures in the Bill are introduced to other species, such as companion animals, we will gather and consider further evidence. We will include monitoring of research and commercial developments, and consideration of animal welfare assessments in such species. The research we are undertaking with Scotland’s Rural College is the first step but, again, this will involve engagement with key stakeholders and experts. I entirely endorse the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Trees, about PRRS—that has to be in our minds when we are talking about this.
I could listen to the noble Lord, Lord Winston, for ever; apart from his having the most mellifluous voice, he is a fantastic communicator—I have watched him on television—but I question his belief that Britain is somehow an outlier. We are aligning with many international partners—for example, the US, Canada, Japan, Argentina and Australia. The EU, as he knows, is also intending to introduce a more proportionate regulatory framework, and we follow that with interest. I hope that he sees that we are part of a wider group of countries that are gently moving forward in a way that accepts high levels of regulation, but also the benefits that this technology could accrue.