My Lords, like the noble Baroness, Lady Sugg, I apologise to the House for not participating on Second Reading. This is one of those rare opportunities for me to be at one with the noble Lord, Lord Blencathra. These opportunities do not arise very often, but today is one of them. Of course we were at one in the debate on the then Trade Bill, and I very much welcome the continued focus on this issue, particularly by the noble Lord, Lord Alton. On the Trade Bill, we—I with my amendment—attempted to ensure that we were not simply trapped by this very strict legal definition of genocide and that we focused on broader human rights issues, particularly when it comes to trade. We find the reason for that when we ask—I pick up the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Polak—“When does genocide start?” How does it start? It often starts by the use and harassment of words; it starts with words.
In quite a few debates I have given books a plug. I am currently reading “Chips” Channon’s diaries, which I would recommend. Reading his discussions during the 1938 crisis, I was struck by how anti-Semitism was just common talk, and how people were portraying Hitler as not that bad, as well as some of the incidents:
Kristallnacht was “unfortunate”. It is those sorts of things that we really do need to focus on, and I hope that the Minister will be able to do that.
This debate is about probing government action; it is not simply saying, “This is our amendment: take it.” This is Committee stage, and I hope we can use it properly to probe the Government because, sadly, I often think—today of all days—that we do not have joined-up government and there is too often a gap between what the Government say and what they do. As the noble Lord, Lord Alton, said, only 12 months ago the Foreign Secretary, now Deputy Prime Minister—who knows what he will be tomorrow—announced business measures regarding human rights abuses in Xinjiang.
I have read the BMA’s briefing, which focused on ethically sourced procurement. That is what this debate is about. It is not just about the definition of genocide. The National Health Service, is, I think, the biggest single procurer of medical products in the world. It has huge opportunities to influence trade and price. We have debates about price and my noble friend Lord Hunt focuses on that a lot. With that leverage, the NHS has the opportunity to influence change. This debate is not about punishing China or the Chinese people but about influencing change and hoping that the Chinese Communist Party and the Chinese Government will think twice about some of the actions they are taking. I hope today we will have an opportunity to probe what the Government are doing, look at what they have said and see what they have done.
Following his announcement in January 2021, Domonic Raab went to the Human Rights Council. There he said:
“The UK will live up to our responsibilities.”
He referred to
“measures aimed at ensuring that no company profiting from forced labour in Xinjiang can do business in the UK, and that no UK businesses are involved in their supply chains.”
That is absolutely right. The promised measures he outlined included
“a Minister led campaign of business engagement to reinforce the need for UK businesses to take action to address the risk.”
Have we seen that? Where is the evidence? I am not sure that I have seen it, even though I have asked numerous questions on the Modern Slavery Act about that.
Dominic Raab then referred to
“a review of export controls as they apply to Xinjiang to ensure the Government is doing all it can to prevent the exports of goods that may contribute to human rights abuses in the region.”
Here, I pick up the point mentioned by my noble friend Lord Hunt: this equipment could be used to do the very things he highlighted regarding organ transplants. I want to hear from the Minister: what are we doing on that commitment made 12 months ago? What are we doing at the WHO on investigating this abhorrent practice?
Dominic Raab also referred to
“the introduction of financial penalties for organisations who fail to meet their statutory obligations to publish annual modern slavery statements, under the Modern Slavery Act.”
I have repeatedly asked Ministers when and how that is happening, but, 12 months later, I have seen no evidence. As we heard in this debate, it is not as if that
obligation is particularly hard to meet. It is not as if it says, “You won’t do this” and “You will do that”. It simply records what they are doing.
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Dominic Raab further spoke of
“new, robust and detailed guidance to UK businesses on the specific risks faced by companies with links to Xinjiang, and underlining the challenges of conducting effective due diligence there.”
We have heard in this debate from my noble friend about what mechanisms could be used to ensure effective due diligence. It is not simply about asking somebody to say what they are doing, with vague promises, but a clear commitment from the Government.
The last point made by Dominic Raab—the Deputy Prime Minister—was that the Government will
“provide guidance and support to UK Government bodies to”
use public procurement rules to
“exclude suppliers where there is sufficient evidence of human rights violations in any of their supply chains.”—[Official Report, Commons, 12/01/21; cols. 161-62.]
Compliance, he said, will be mandatory for central government, non-departmental bodies and executive agencies. Where is the evidence, 12 months on from that Statement, that they will do this?
I strongly support this amendment; I will back it to the hilt. I will listen very carefully to what the Minister says but, if there are insufficient responses on what the Government has been doing over the last 12 months, I would hope that we will see more amendments on Report to make sure that the Government keep their word and hold to the commitment they have made.
There is lots more that I could say—I was going to repeat some of the words of the noble Lord, Lord Ahmad —but we have had a very strong debate and there is a clear view across the House that this is not a partisan issue. Once again, the noble Lord, Lord Blencathra, is absolutely right. I will back him on this amendment, and let us ensure that the Government keep their word.