My Lords, I agree with the comments of my noble friend Lord Hunt of Kings Heath, and other noble Lords, that we have had mixed experiences of police and crime commissioners—some have been very good, and some not so good. I will not go further than that, though, in relation to Amendment 278.
I wish to talk in particular about the amendment in the names of my noble friends Lord Bach and Lord Hunt of Kings Heath. They have drawn attention to the consequences we have witnessed as result of potential candidates for police and crime commissioner being debarred if they have been convicted of any offence, however many years ago, for which they could have received a custodial sentence, irrespective of whether they did actually receive such a sentence. I do not wish to pursue any individual cases but rather the general point, as others have done, of whether there should be another look at the reasons, in respect of previous convictions, for which a potential candidate for the office of police and crime commissioner can be disqualified.
When the issue has been raised previously, the Government have argued that it should not be reviewed because there was cross-party support for this requirement to be included in the Police Reform and Social Responsibility Act 2011. If that argument was followed through to its logical conclusion, there could never be any change to any legislation that originally had cross-party support, which is a bit of a nonsense.
The other argument advanced was that people must have complete confidence in the probity and integrity of whoever it is they elect as a police and crime commissioner because of their responsibilities and powers in relation to their police force, including the chief constable. Clearly, that is true, but whether an offence committed decades ago that could have resulted in a custodial sentence but did not—because it was not considered of a sufficiently serious nature to justify such a sentence—should automatically still be regarded as calling into question the probity and integrity of a potential candidate for police and crime commissioner, and thus disqualify them from holding such an office, is questionable, to say the least. It is certainly questionable when one looks at other positions that have powers and responsibilities in relation to the police and the criminal justice system but have no such similar restrictions on being able to stand for office or be appointed to an office.
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The Home Secretary has far more powers and influence in relation to the police and chief constables than a police and crime commissioner, who is not permitted to get involved in operational matters, which are the preserve of a chief constable. The present Home Secretary has made it clear on more than one occasion that she speaks regularly to chief constables—and I do not think it is to discuss the weather. At the time of the vigil in London following the murder of Sarah Everard, the Home Secretary made it clear that, on the day, she had been in regular touch with the Metropolitan Police Commissioner. It is inconceivable that the Home Secretary was not asking what was happening, what the police were doing and why.
The Home Secretary also has a key role in the appointment and tenure in office of the Metropolitan Police Commissioner. Yet unlike the position of police and crime commissioner, there is nothing that disqualifies a person from being Home Secretary if they have been convicted of an offence, however many years ago, for which they could have received a custodial sentence.
A Home Secretary has overall responsibility for the police and proposes legislative changes affecting the police, including police and crime commissioners. Indeed, it was the then Home Secretary who sponsored the legislation that applied the current restriction on potential candidates becoming police and crime commissioners, but did not think the same restriction should apply to the office of Home Secretary.
As far as I know, there is no national legislation that precludes a person who, at some time, has had a previous conviction for which they could have received a custodial sentence becoming a police officer. As a police officer, that person could rise through the ranks to become chief constable. There is no legislation that disqualifies a person who, at some time, has had a previous conviction for which they could have received a custodial sentence from becoming a magistrate, a Member of Parliament or, as far as I know, a judge. Why then does the existing restriction continue to apply to the post of police and crime commissioner, irrespective of whether a custodial sentence was handed out, how many years ago the offence was committed and the nature of the offence? Like my noble friend Lord Bach and others, I believe it is time to reconsider whether the current restriction on being able to be a police and crime commissioner should continue to apply in its present sweeping and absolute form.
We certainly do not want people with criminal tendencies, or with no respect for the law and policing, becoming police and crime commissioners. Equally, we do not want to preclude people of ability or who have much to offer from being able to be a police and crime commissioner on the basis of a minor offence, committed many years ago, and certainly not when that restriction does not apply to other equally or more influential positions that also have public involvement with policy and direction related to the running and functioning of our criminal justice system.