I rise to speak to Motion F1 in my name and to speak in support of Amendment 6B. I refer the House to my interests, particularly as founder and chair of the 5Rights Foundation. I noted the Minister’s words at the outset, and I will return to them. But for the purposes of the House and those who might be drafting such an amendment, I want to set out my reasons for the amendment that we have before us.
Since we last debated this amendment, a number of significant things have happened which have made it necessary to re-present it. First are events in Canada: against the will of many politicians of all stripes, the free trade agreement between the United States, Canada and Mexico saw the inclusion of Section 230-style protections for tech firms. At the time, the Canadian Government promised parliamentarians that nothing in the agreement would impinge on their ability to regulate companies under existing or future Canadian law.
Canada is the base for Pornhub, the largest pornography site in the world. But when Pornhub was found to be monetising child rape and child sexual
abuse material, the Canadian Government representative in the Senate, Senator Marc Gold, had to admit that
“there are provisions in the”
USMCA
“that make it difficult to deal with a company like Pornhub.”
Canadian parliamentarians scored one small concession during the passage of that free trade agreement: to keep domestic criminal laws on prostitution, sex trafficking and sexual exploitation. It is agreed by the Government that these are now the only Canadian domestic laws in this policy area that take precedence over the terms of the agreement.
Motion F1 does not refer to a theoretical concern. This is a clear and present danger, and it is designed to prevent the powerlessness currently experienced by Canadian lawmakers as we speak. It would, if it were adopted as a whole, put UK online protections beyond doubt.
I have been very grateful for the time given to me and Members of the other place by the Minister and his colleague Greg Hands, the Minister for Trade, and I actually agree with them that we are entirely aligned in this policy area and that the Government have reason to be proud. None the less, I have to challenge their assurance that it simply could not happen on their watch—because it already has.
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In the recent Japan-UK trade deal, 98% of the text is a carbon copy of the EU-Japan FTA, but slipped into this continuity deal is wording that is almost identical to that of the USMCA. While it stops short of inserting Section 230 wording—since it is not a US deal—its provision on domestic regulation says:
“Each Party shall ensure that all its measures of general application affecting electronic commerce, including measures related to its collection of information, are administered in a reasonable, objective and impartial manner.”
By contrast, the wording it replaces in the EU deal says:
“The Parties reaffirm the right to regulate within their territories to achieve legitimate policy objectives, such as the protection of public health, social services, public education, safety, the environment including climate change, public morals, social or consumer protection, privacy and data protection, or the promotion and protection of cultural diversity.”
That is the wording that allowed the UK to introduce the children’s code into the Data Protection Act, and the wording that allowed the Government to put forward the provisions they are suggesting for the online harms Bill, including a duty of care, and all the other provisions and progress that we might make in this area.
Public Citizen in the US—renowned experts on international trade—suggests that, if UK data protection and the provisions envisaged for the online harms Bill were contested under the language in the Japanese deal, in the way the Pornhub case was in Canada, it would fall foul of the law. But more important even than whether I am right or wrong is the fact that, whether or not this vague wording would result in blocking UK policy, it would take years of legal action with the companies with the deepest pockets in the world—and therefore a lack of protection for all that time—while we found out.
I acknowledge what the Minister has already said, and I want him, when he reappears on the screen, magically, to wind up, to assure me that what he is
proposing is sufficient for the protections not only that children need but that the Government need in order to protect their own policy programme. I understand that the Government are not minded to accept my amendment and that the parliamentary maths allows them that privilege, but I want to make three brief points in favour of doing so.
Since we first divided on this matter, TikTok announced changes to its platform, across the globe that are a direct result of the regulatory requirements of the ICO’s children’s code. Similar changes have been and will be announced by Silicon Valley companies that have resisted such changes for years. It would be simply devasting to the UK’s reputation to put this landmark piece of legislation at risk just as legislators and regulators from Australia to Africa are seeking to mirror its provisions. The global community looks to the UK for leadership on this issue. A clear provision in the Bill that these advances will be protected would confirm that leadership.
Secondly, there is a growing consensus, in and out of Parliament, that we must tackle the harms of the digital world in a more fundamental way. The vote in the Commons was on party lines, but the machinations of Parliament do not actually reflect the true feeling. If my inbox is anything to go by, it does not reflect, either, the feelings of the Government Benches in this House or the other place. When I went to see the Minister for Trade on two separate occasions, I was accompanied each time by a very senior member of his own party, and I thank them both. I believe it would commend the Government to Members of both Houses and all parties were they to find a way to insert an absolute protection for children—not a fig leaf—into the Bill.
Thirdly, as the Canadian example exemplifies, there is no promise made at the Dispatch Box that can offer the level of certainty that UK children deserve.
As well as what the Minister suggests will be in the non-regression amendment, I ask him to confirm that keeping Section 230 language, or language like it, out of all trade deals is a stated objective of UK negotiators. I would like him to defy expectations and parliamentary maths and give an unequivocal commitment that, by hook or by crook, the online protections for children in the Bill will be fit for purpose.
I turn to the amendment in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Grantchester. I thank the noble Lord for adding, in paragraph (e), online protections of children and vulnerable adults. For the reasons that I have set out, it would be insincere to say that it was equal in scope to what I originally suggested, but to my knowledge this is the first time that online protections for children have been included in the same breath as the long-standing issues of workers’ rights, protecting the NHS and food and environmental standards. That is a huge step forward in acknowledging the importance of online protections for children.
I worry on behalf of children and indeed on behalf of the Government that it does not affect the protection for the Government’s flagship online safety Bill unless a trade deal, by luck, happens to come about after that Bill completes its passage. I hope the Government intend to move very fast. I am confident that the House wants
to see non-regression of existing standards, but again I appeal to the Minister that his commitment is clear and profound and that the government amendment in the Commons, in a further round of ping-pong if necessary, will reach the same objectives.
Lest anyone forget, in listening to the intricate detail of the language of trade deals, what we are talking about here is our ability to prevent the wholesale spread of harmful material such as those offered by self-harm and pro-suicide sites, the nudging of children to meet stranger adults in online settings and the egregious targeting of children with cosmetic surgery and other inappropriate advertising, and the ability to prevent sites such as Pornhub freely monetising rape. The harm is not theoretical—it is manifest in the lives of millions of children—and neither is the danger of undermining our world-leading legislation by means of a trade deal. I thank the Minister for his words and I hope he will join me in building the digital world that children deserve.