My Lords, I acknowledge the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Stevenson, that this is a significant issue, and I understand that this is
a probing amendment to allow us to consider some of the wider issues that he has touched on in the debate.
Amendment 117A seeks to include in the Bill an additional purpose: to enable debt information to be shared under the powers provided by Clause 41. It seeks to state explicitly that debt data can be disclosed,
“for the purpose of helping individuals to manage their debts”.
There is also a reference to the breathing space, and I will come back to that point in a moment in response to the questions posed by the noble Lord.
In the first instance, we would venture that the amendment is not necessary. The provisions as drafted enable information to be shared,
“for the purposes of the taking of action in connection with debt owed to”,
a public authority or the Crown. This includes but is not limited to, for example, identifying or collecting debt. The provision is sufficiently broad to enable sharing for the purpose set out in this amendment. That is the position of the Government. The Government are considering the recommendations that have been made following work to look into the merits of introducing a breathing space for customers, which we are aware is available in other jurisdictions. While the Government are considering these recommendations, it would be premature to incorporate a reference to this initiative in the Bill at this time. I hope the noble Lord will accept that the matter is being looked at.
9.45 pm
The effect of Amendment 133 would be that any public authority or person providing services to a public authority in identifying or collecting debt, bringing civil proceedings or taking administrative action as a result of debt of that kind would have, in doing so, to comply with the Clause 45 code of practice, regardless of whether they were using the Clause 41 power. A wide range of public authorities and devolved Administrations need flexibility and autonomy to manage their own unique debt portfolios in the most suitable way, and in line with the legislative powers ascribed to them. There are a range of existing procedures and powers specific to particular bodies. We consider that it would be unhelpful simply to cut across these.
Amendment 132 prescribes more detail for the contents of the code. We have already touched upon the codes. Proposed new subsections (3B) and (3C) would require the code to contain provisions requiring specified persons intending to make use of the debt power,
“to have in place procedures to identify vulnerable people and take appropriate account of their needs and circumstances”,
and,
“to assess the affordability of debt repayments by reference to a common standard”.
The code would also have to include provision requiring specified persons, before taking any action following the sharing of information under the debt power,
“to consider the welfare of the people who owe the debt”.
The code of practice already contains fairness principles, which were developed across government and with debt advice charities. These are intended to enable a common approach to fairness when public authorities collaborate to develop pilot activity under
the debt data-sharing power. Furthermore, the codes will be put out for further consultation before they are finalised, so we do not want to pre-empt this exercise by inserting requirements at this level of detail on its content at this stage. However, I note what the noble Lord said with regard to the codes. They are still being looked at and will be looked at further in this context.
I understand the desire to ensure that the codes are effective; it is the desire of the Government as well. As the noble Lord observed, you can press so hard in the matter of debt recovery but, as banks and others have discovered in the past, if you press too hard something breaks and nothing is returned. We suggest that the codes provide a strong safeguard for the use of the powers, backed up by real consequences if they are not adhered to. There is a power there to ensure that although the Bill says “have regard to”, it is a legal obligation and suitably flexible in the context of these powers. While we continue to consider the recommendations of the Delegated Powers Committee, which also touched upon this, I invite the noble Lord to withdraw his amendment.