UK Parliament / Open data

Financial Services (Banking Reform) Bill

Debate on bills on Wednesday, 11 December 2013, in the House of Commons, led by Sajid Javid. The answering member was Cathy Jamieson.
Money resolution. Resolved with Queen's recommendation signified. Ways and means resolution (No. 2). Resolved. Programme motion (No. 3) on proceedings on consideration of Lords amendments and subsequent stages. Agreed to on question. Lords amendments considered. The Speaker announced that Lords amendments 35, 37, 40, 64, 149, 150, 162, 163, 169, 171, 172, 173 and 175 engaged Commons financial privilege. Commons disagreement with Lords amendment 41, discussed with Lords amendments 42 to 62, 160 and 174, agreed to on division (299 to 222). Commons agreement with Lords amendment 63, discussed with Lords amendments 64 to 154, Lords amendment 155 and amendments (a) and (b) thereto, and Lords amendments 156, 161 to 163, 169 to 172, 175 to 180 and 182 to 184. Agreed to on question. Lords amendments 1 to 40 agreed to, with Commons financial privileges waived in respect of Lords amendments 35, 37 and 40. Lords amendments 42 to 62 agreed to on question. Lords amendments 64 to 154 agreed to, with Commons financial privileges waived in respect of Lords amendments 149 and 150. Amendment (a) to Lords amendment 155 negatived on division (225 to 289). Amendment (b) to Lords amendment 155 negatived on division (228 to 297). Lords amendments 155 to 184 agreed to with Commons financial privileges waived in respect of Lords amendments 162, 163, 169, 171 to 173 and 175. Bill title amended. Motion that a Committee be appointed to draw up Reasons to be assigned to the Lords for disagreeing to their amendment 41. Agreed to on question. Reasons Committee reported its reason to the House and this was agreed to on question. Message to the Lords to communicate the said Reason, with the Bill.
Type
Parliamentary proceeding
Reference
572 cc248-315 
Session
2013-14
Department
Treasury
Legislative stage
Lords amendments
Chamber / Committee
House of Commons chamber
Financial Services (Banking Reform) Bill 2013-14. Lords amendments.
Monday, 9 December 2013
Bills
House of Commons
Proceeding contributions
John Bercow | 572 c249 (Link to this contribution)

I must draw the House’s attention to the fact that financial privilege is involved in Lords amend...

Sajid Javid | 572 c249 (Link to this contribution)

I beg to move, That this House disagrees with Lords amendment 41.


Show all contributions (158)
John Bercow | 572 c249 (Link to this contribution)

With this we may take Lords amendments 42 to 62, 160 and 174.

Sajid Javid | 572 cc249-250 (Link to this contribution)

It is a pleasure to introduce these amendments. Much work has been undertaken in this House and i...

Neil Parish | 572 c250 (Link to this contribution)

Does the Minister agree that it is essential that companies can trust their banks in order that t...

Sajid Javid | 572 cc250-1 (Link to this contribution)

I agree wholeheartedly with my hon. Friend, and I hope that he agrees that all the effort that ha...

Emily Thornberry | 572 c252 (Link to this contribution)

With hindsight, will the hon. Gentleman help the House and say whether Fred Goodwin would have be...

Sajid Javid | 572 c252 (Link to this contribution)

It is possible, although it is difficult to answer that question specifically as it would depend ...

Mark Garnier | 572 c252 (Link to this contribution)

Does the Minister agree that a lot of the changes that are coming through as a result of PCBS rec...

Sajid Javid | 572 c252 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend has explained well the reasoning behind the recommendation from the PCBS—which, of...

Emily Thornberry | 572 c252 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the Minister for giving way again; he is helpful in giving me the time because I am genui...

Sajid Javid | 572 c252 (Link to this contribution)

As I discuss the issue I will provide more information on how the measure could work, and perhaps...

Lord Tyrie | 572 c252 (Link to this contribution)

First, I think it would be inappropriate to try to assess the impact of the proposed legislation ...

Sajid Javid | 572 cc252-3 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for his comments. As Chair of the Parliamentary Commission on Banking Stan...

Andrew Love | 572 c253 (Link to this contribution)

The Minister struck the correct note when he mentioned the seriousness of such situations. Much c...

Sajid Javid | 572 c253 (Link to this contribution)

I completely agree with the hon. Gentleman and I think we all hope that the new criminal sanction...

Emily Thornberry | 572 c253 (Link to this contribution)

If I were a senior banker to whom this law applied, what would affect my decision on whether to b...

Sajid Javid | 572 c253 (Link to this contribution)

Both cases would be a deterrent. A key point of the change to criminal sanctions is that they wou...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c254 (Link to this contribution)

I have listened with interest to the Minister. May I first add my thanks to all the members of th...

Gordon Marsden | 572 c254 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is detailing, forensically and importantly, the logjam that this process has produ...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c254 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes an important point. It is vital that the public has confidence in the proces...

Andrew Love | 572 c255 (Link to this contribution)

Before my hon. Friend moves on, does she agree that while we should congratulate Members in the o...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c255 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes a valuable point. It would have stood us in good stead had we had such an op...

Emily Thornberry | 572 c255 (Link to this contribution)

Is my hon. Friend satisfied with the definition of senior bankers as those who would be liable to...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 cc255-6 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes another interesting point. She has already raised the likelihood of criminal...

Gordon Marsden | 572 c256 (Link to this contribution)

I am listening carefully to my hon. Friend as she lists the specific attempts that we on this sid...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c257 (Link to this contribution)

We pressed for an earlier introduction of the measure so that we could debate and finesse it if n...

Stephen Doughty | 572 c257 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is making a strong case. I, too, served on the Committee and witnessed our efforts...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c257 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for his comments. I do not know what was in the Government’s mind, but in ...

Ian Swales | 572 c257 (Link to this contribution)

As a member of an accountancy body that deals with police professional standards and continuing p...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c257 (Link to this contribution)

I understand the hon. Gentleman’s point. Our approach has been to suggest that that responsibilit...

Andrew Love | 572 c257 (Link to this contribution)

As a member of the parliamentary commission, I note that despite our many recommendations, which ...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 cc257-9 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is absolutely right. If we believe the Bill to be the end of the story, we will do...

Mark Garnier | 572 c259 (Link to this contribution)

Is the shadow Minister aware that the banks have already initiated the creation of a professional...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 cc259-260 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the hon. Gentleman for that comment. I know that he has done considerable work in his rol...

Andrew Love | 572 c260 (Link to this contribution)

Does the banking industry not make it more difficult for the public to understand, given that, ev...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c260 (Link to this contribution)

Once again, my hon. Friend is absolutely correct. The general public expected the industry to sho...

Lord Tyrie | 572 cc260-2 (Link to this contribution)

Before addressing the amendments in the group, I would like to say a few words—this is the only a...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c262 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman mentioned proprietary trading. Is he now satisfied that the Government’s recen...

Lord Tyrie | 572 c262 (Link to this contribution)

Broadly, yes. Given that I am already stretching things a little in my opening remarks, I will tr...

Andrew Love | 572 c262 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Lord Tyrie | 572 c262 (Link to this contribution)

I give way to my fellow commissioner.

Andrew Love | 572 c262 (Link to this contribution)

How long does the hon. Gentleman think the handing of control over the leverage ratio to the Bank...

Lord Tyrie | 572 cc262-3 (Link to this contribution)

I have pressed the Bank of England on that issue with my Treasury Select Committee hat on. A subs...

Emily Thornberry | 572 c263 (Link to this contribution)

I am listening with great interest to the hon. Gentleman. As he may know, the United States opera...

Lord Tyrie | 572 cc263-4 (Link to this contribution)

In some cases, the “deal”, as the hon. Lady called it, is accompanied by a memorandum of understa...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c264 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Lord Tyrie | 572 c264 (Link to this contribution)

I will give way again, but I do want to get on to the amendments.

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c264 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the hon. Gentleman for his generosity. The question of whistleblowers was raised in a Lab...

Lord Tyrie | 572 cc264-6 (Link to this contribution)

I think that, in the first instance, it is the job of regulators to advise us—we shall see whethe...

Ian Swales | 572 c266 (Link to this contribution)

As I expected, the hon. Gentleman is making an incredibly thoughtful and powerful speech. We have...

Lord Tyrie | 572 c266 (Link to this contribution)

I think the banks have discovered that the scale of the damage done by the revelations and the sc...

Lord Tyrie | 572 c266 (Link to this contribution)

I will this one last time, but I get a sense that Members might want me to draw to a close in a m...

Emily Thornberry | 572 c266 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman mentions LIBOR. In respect in particular of fraud, does he agree that if an in...

Lord Tyrie | 572 c267 (Link to this contribution)

The fact that an individual is found responsible should not in any way exculpate the institution ...

John Bercow | 572 c267 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Gentleman’s speech is characterised, as always, by a combination of scholarship and erud...

Lord Tyrie | 572 cc267-8 (Link to this contribution)

I can give you a firm assurance, Mr Speaker, that I am coming very close to the end of my remarks...

John Bercow | 572 c268 (Link to this contribution)

Order. I should explain to the House that I have exercised some latitude so that the hon. Member ...

Yasmin Qureshi | 572 cc268-270 (Link to this contribution)

I will bear in mind your observations, Mr Speaker, but I hope you will indulge me if I occasional...

Ian Swales | 572 cc271-2 (Link to this contribution)

I will keep my remarks relatively brief. Neither of the two major parties has too much to crow ab...

Emily Thornberry | 572 c272 (Link to this contribution)

It has been said that one of the great innovations of this Bill is the introduction of the offenc...

Lord Tyrie | 572 c273 (Link to this contribution)

The question the hon. Lady should ask herself is that if she were a banker, would she be prepared...

Emily Thornberry | 572 c273 (Link to this contribution)

There are other things that can be done, and I shall briefly touch on some of them. May I begin w...

Mark Garnier | 572 c273 (Link to this contribution)

I am fascinated that the hon. Lady chooses to use Nick Leeson as an example, because he went to j...

Emily Thornberry | 572 c273 (Link to this contribution)

The point is that he was not a senior manager and he brought down a bank. This measure will not s...

Lord Tyrie | 572 c273 (Link to this contribution)

I think the hon. Lady is misunderstanding the intentions of each bit of legislative change. The p...

Emily Thornberry | 572 cc273-4 (Link to this contribution)

With respect, I am even more confused than before. What is the point of bringing in an offence th...

Guy Opperman | 572 c274 (Link to this contribution)

Let me take the hon. Lady back to her last point on prosecutions. I speak as a former prosecutor ...

Emily Thornberry | 572 cc274-5 (Link to this contribution)

I am more than happy to put it on the record that I am a critical friend of the Serious Fraud Off...

Mark Garnier | 572 c275 (Link to this contribution)

I intend to talk principally about Lords amendment 41, but before I do so let me echo the comment...

Andrew Love | 572 c275 (Link to this contribution)

Is the hon. Gentleman not disappointed that, since 2007, when there has been such a focus on the ...

Mark Garnier | 572 cc275-7 (Link to this contribution)

I do not necessarily agree. I speak not only as a Member of Parliament, a member of the Parliamen...

Stewart Hosie | 572 c277 (Link to this contribution)

The personal responsibility argument is extremely strong and powerful, but does not the hon. Gent...

Mark Garnier | 572 c277 (Link to this contribution)

I agree entirely. A number of professional bodies in the banking industry have a code of conduct....

Sajid Javid | 572 c277 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Kilmarnock and Loudoun (Cathy Jamieson), for her...

Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 572 c277 (Link to this contribution)

Order. With the leave of the House, Minister.

Sajid Javid | 572 cc277-8 (Link to this contribution)

Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. With the leave of the House, I thank the shadow Minister for her...

Sajid Javid | 572 c278 (Link to this contribution)

I beg to move, That this House agrees with Lords amendment 63.

Baroness Laing of Elderslie | 572 c278 (Link to this contribution)

With this it will be convenient to discuss the following:

Lords amendments 64 to 154.

Sajid Javid | 572 cc278-283 (Link to this contribution)

The second group of amendments introduce substantial changes that will ensure that consumers get ...

Ian Swales | 572 c283 (Link to this contribution)

With regard to account number portability, is the Minister concerned that in the period between n...

Sajid Javid | 572 c283 (Link to this contribution)

I have listened to my hon. Friend carefully, and others have made that point previously, but I do...

David Mowat | 572 c283 (Link to this contribution)

I very much welcome the role that the payments regulator will have. For the avoidance of doubt, t...

Sajid Javid | 572 c284 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, I can confirm that. Although it remains for the regulator, once set up, to deem the regulate...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c284 (Link to this contribution)

What analysis have the Government undertaken of the impact of designating card payment systems fo...

Sajid Javid | 572 cc284-5 (Link to this contribution)

Before we made the final decision to create the regulator, a full consultation was carried out. W...

Yasmin Qureshi | 572 c285 (Link to this contribution)

We welcome the change, but it will not start until January 2015. Our amendment (a) says that it s...

Sajid Javid | 572 c285 (Link to this contribution)

If the hon. Lady will allow me, I will answer her questions when I consider the amendment she men...

Bob Stewart | 572 c285 (Link to this contribution)

Does my hon. Friend have any idea what level of cap there might be on such charges?

Sajid Javid | 572 c285 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend asks a reasonable question that I am sure many Members would be concerned about. T...

Graham Stuart | 572 c285 (Link to this contribution)

I do not really understand what the Minister says about a cap protecting consumers. Before we had...

Sajid Javid | 572 c285 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend raises a good point. A number of charity groups involved in the debt advisory sect...

Pat McFadden | 572 c285 (Link to this contribution)

Following on from the previous question, surely the Minister agrees that we can do better than of...

Sajid Javid | 572 c286 (Link to this contribution)

I agree with the right hon. Gentleman that it is certainly possible to have a better system than ...

Edward Leigh | 572 c286 (Link to this contribution)

I am sorry to say this to the Minister, but he has not replied to the point made by my hon. Frien...

Sajid Javid | 572 c286 (Link to this contribution)

If my hon. Friend will allow me, I will, as I move on, provide more information on that particula...

Andrew Love | 572 c286 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the Minister for giving way so liberally on this issue. He mentioned the FCA’s role not j...

Sajid Javid | 572 cc286-7 (Link to this contribution)

The measures that the FCA has already suggested, and on which it is currently consulting, go a lo...

Stephen Doughty | 572 c287 (Link to this contribution)

Given that the Government have moved belatedly on this issue—I hope it will make a big difference...

Sajid Javid | 572 c287 (Link to this contribution)

I assure the hon. Gentleman that we as a Government have spoken to many stakeholders, including h...

Sajid Javid | 572 c287 (Link to this contribution)

I will take this as a final intervention, because I need to plough on in the interests of time.

Yasmin Qureshi | 572 c287 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the Minister for giving way; it will not take long. Following the point made by my hon. F...

Sajid Javid | 572 c287 (Link to this contribution)

I will. The hon. Member for Walthamstow, my hon. Friend the Member for Worcester (Mr Walker) and ...

Sajid Javid | 572 c287 (Link to this contribution)

I will give way for the last time.

Nigel Mills | 572 c287 (Link to this contribution)

I am grateful to the Minister for giving way one very last time. I am not sure that I agree with ...

Sajid Javid | 572 cc288-9 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for his intervention. I think that the FCA, acting independently and looki...

Stephen Doughty | 572 c289 (Link to this contribution)

Notwithstanding the points that the Minister is making, many consumers and campaigners on this is...

Sajid Javid | 572 cc289-290 (Link to this contribution)

I will say a little more about the timetable in a moment, but it is a bit unfair of the hon. Gent...

Sajid Javid | 572 c290 (Link to this contribution)

I need to plough on; I am sorry.

I thank the hon. Member for Kilmarnock and Loudoun for giv...

Nigel Mills | 572 c290 (Link to this contribution)

If the Minister had had the pleasure of sitting on the Bill Committee, he would know that I table...

Sajid Javid | 572 c291 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend will know that the Government have introduced many initiatives to increase competi...

Lord Tyrie | 572 c291 (Link to this contribution)

The Treasury Committee and the Banking Commission are extremely grateful that the lion’s share of...

Sajid Javid | 572 c291 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend will know that the FCA currently has an objective to promote competition, and I kn...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 cc291-2 (Link to this contribution)

I will develop my arguments in a moment, but I give notice that at the appropriate stage we will ...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c292 (Link to this contribution)

Let us remember that, during the passage of the first Financial Services Bill, Labour tabled amen...

Brooks Newmark | 572 c292 (Link to this contribution)

I am sure we all agree that the abuse of payday lending is a scourge, and has been a scourge for ...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c292 (Link to this contribution)

I had hoped that the hon. Gentleman would explain why the Government opposed Labour’s amendments....

Stephen Doughty | 572 c293 (Link to this contribution)

I apologise for omitting to mention my membership of the national committee of Movement for Chang...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c293 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes valuable points, which I will come on to address.

The Government oppos...

Sheila Gilmore | 572 c293 (Link to this contribution)

I am sure my hon. Friend agrees that, had there been an agreement earlier, some of the people sti...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 cc293-4 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend makes a valid point. Members in all parties will have seen the sector’s expansion ...

Jonathan Edwards | 572 c294 (Link to this contribution)

I am sure the shadow Minister watched the recent item on “Newsnight” on this issue with great int...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 cc294-5 (Link to this contribution)

That is an important issue that ought to give us more food for thought. In certain circumstances,...

Lord Walney | 572 c295 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is making a very good speech. We have heard the Minister say at the Dispatch Box t...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c295 (Link to this contribution)

I thank my hon. Friend for his kind words about my comments. I am simply putting forward the view...

Stephen Doughty | 572 c295 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend has made an important point about the amount of money such companies are investing...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c295 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend tempts me to talk about football, which is one of my favourite topics. I will resi...

Stella Creasy | 572 c296 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend is making a fantastic case to show why real-time credit checking is so important i...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c296 (Link to this contribution)

My hon. Friend, who has campaigned for many years on this particular issue, makes a very good poi...

Brooks Newmark | 572 c296 (Link to this contribution)

Following the intervention by the hon. Member for Walthamstow (Stella Creasy), I have to say that...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 cc296-7 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the hon. Gentleman, whose comments were slightly more supportive than I expected them to ...

Ian Swales | 572 c297 (Link to this contribution)

Is the hon. Lady aware that some of those charges apply even if the overdraft lasts for only a da...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 cc297-8 (Link to this contribution)

The specific examples that I cited had been reported to me, but I understand that in many instanc...

Lord Tyrie | 572 c298 (Link to this contribution)

On payday loans, I only want to make two very quick points. First, we need to be very careful tha...

Stella Creasy | 572 c298 (Link to this contribution)

Will the hon. Gentleman give way?

Lord Tyrie | 572 c298 (Link to this contribution)

If the hon. Lady will forgive me, I will not, because I promised the Chair that I will speak for ...

Yvonne Fovargue | 572 cc298-300 (Link to this contribution)

I regard payday lending as a new industry. We have heard talk about how Labour did nothing for 13...

Andrea Leadsom | 572 c300 (Link to this contribution)

I rise to congratulate the Minister on the excellent introduction of an independent payments regu...

Ian Swales | 572 c300 (Link to this contribution)

The hon. Lady is making a powerful point. Does she agree that a parallel situation would be havin...

Andrea Leadsom | 572 cc300-1 (Link to this contribution)

Yes, my hon. Friend is absolutely right. There are huge parallels between the banking closed shop...

Paul Blomfield | 572 cc301-3 (Link to this contribution)

Like my hon. Friend the Member for Makerfield (Yvonne Fovargue), I rise to speak on amendment 155...

Sajid Javid | 572 cc303-4 (Link to this contribution)

With the leave of the House, Madam Deputy Speaker. I thank all hon. Members for their contributio...

Yvonne Fovargue | 572 c304 (Link to this contribution)

Will the Minister therefore set a time scale for the FCA to give the industry to work towards vol...

Sajid Javid | 572 c304 (Link to this contribution)

There is already the tightest possible time scale. In his letter today Martin Wheatley of the FCA...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c304 (Link to this contribution)

To follow up the point from my hon. Friend the Member for Makerfield (Yvonne Fovargue), it would ...

Sajid Javid | 572 c305 (Link to this contribution)

I have had discussions with the FCA about this. We expect that by the end of next year the proces...

Stella Creasy | 572 c305 (Link to this contribution)

We know that 1 million families in this country have already said that they will pay for Christma...

Sajid Javid | 572 c305 (Link to this contribution)

I thank the hon. Lady for her comments. As she will have noted from the letter I just quoted from...

Cathy Jamieson | 572 c306 (Link to this contribution)

The Minister might have already answered this, but what specific legal risk has he identified in ...

Sajid Javid | 572 c306 (Link to this contribution)

I refer the hon. Lady again to the letter from Martin Wheatley, which states that the FCA

“...

John Denham | 572 c306 (Link to this contribution)

On a point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. Earlier this afternoon I was alerted to a tweet from t...

Baroness Primarolo | 572 c315 (Link to this contribution)

Obviously, the contents of comments on Twitter are not a matter for the Chair, but if this has oc...

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