Offender Management Bill

Debate on bills on Wednesday, 18 July 2007, in the House of Commons.

Offender Management Bill. Programme motion (No 3) on consideration of Lords amendments and subsequent stages. Agreed to on question. Lords amendments considered. Lords amendment 6 debated and disagreed to on division (297 to 169). Lords amendment 22 disagreed to on division (286 to 159). Lords amendment 11 disagreed to and Government amendment (a) in lieu agreed to. Lords amendment 8 disagreed to and Government amendment (a) in lieu agreed to. Lords amendment 35 agreed to as amended on division (266 to 127). Committee appointed to draw up reasons to be assigned to the Lords for disagreeing to their amendments 6, 9, 12, 13, 22, 23 and 38. Reasons reported and agreed to. Message to the Lords to communicate reasons.

Type

Parliamentary proceeding

Reference

463 c350-94

Session

2006-07

Department

Ministry of Justice

Legislative stage

Lords amendments

Procedure

Programme motions

Chamber / Committee

House of Commons chamber

Offender Management Bill. Lords amendments. Explanatory Notes Bill 147-EN also published.
Monday, 16 July 2007
Bills
House of Commons

Offender Management Bill. Commons reasons and amendments.
Thursday, 19 July 2007
Bills
House of Lords

Proceeding contributions

Speaker | 463 c351 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to take Lords amendment No. 8 and the Government motion to disagree ...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c351 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House disagrees with the Lords in the said amendment.

Show all contributions (86)

Patrick Hall | 463 c352 (Link to this contribution) My right hon. Friend has just mentioned a very significant and welcome development in the way in whi...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c351-2 (Link to this contribution) May I begin by expressing the Government’s appreciation of the very careful scrutiny that the Bill r...

Speaker | 463 c352 (Link to this contribution) Order. Perhaps, having given some of the background, the Minister will now limit his remarks to the ...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c352 (Link to this contribution) I will, Madam Deputy Speaker, but commissioning at national, regional and local level, to which my h...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c391 (Link to this contribution) The amendments are all relatively minor, technical and consequential, and I do not propose to speak ...

Speaker | 463 c391 (Link to this contribution) With this we may discuss Lords amendments Nos. 2, 3, 7, 10, 17 to 19, 21, 24 to 34, 37, 42 to 46 and...

Peter Bone | 463 c389 (Link to this contribution) I hope that the Minister agrees that just because the order is prayed against does not necessarily m...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c389 (Link to this contribution) With the leave of the House, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I have accepted the other place’s proposal that pa...

Jeremy Browne | 463 c388-9 (Link to this contribution) I congratulate both the Minister and the hon. and learned Member for Harborough (Mr. Garnier) on mak...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c386 (Link to this contribution) I apologise, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I am seeking to agree with amendment No. 14, so I beg to move, That...

Lord Garnier | 463 c386 (Link to this contribution) Before the Minister concludes his remarks, may I clarify his position, so that I can respond more or...

Speaker | 463 c385 (Link to this contribution) Order. May I interrupt the Minister, as it is important for us to clarify the position? Is the Minis...

Peter Bone | 463 c388 (Link to this contribution) Is not one of the problems with the Government that they are including more and more secondary legis...

Lord Garnier | 463 c388 (Link to this contribution) I wholeheartedly agree. The Government increasingly use administrative convenience to justify reduci...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c386 (Link to this contribution) For the avoidance of confusion—I would not want to confuse the House in the presence of such an emin...

Lord Garnier | 463 c386-8 (Link to this contribution) I think that I now understand what the Government are seeking to achieve. I am pleased that they are...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c390 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House agrees with the Lords in the said amendments.

Lord Garnier | 463 c390 (Link to this contribution) While the official Opposition may disagree with points of detail, I understand from those who know m...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c389 (Link to this contribution) I accept that, and I appreciate the point that the hon. Gentleman has made. However, I must tell the...

Lord Garnier | 463 c389 (Link to this contribution) Conversely, does the Minister not accept that if it is an uncontroversial matter but is none the les...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c389 (Link to this contribution) As a former business manager in another life, I certainly would not want to have been upset in that ...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c390 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, that this House agrees with the Lords in the said amendment.

Lord Garnier | 463 c390 (Link to this contribution) On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Will you confirm for the benefit of all hon. Members that G...

Speaker | 463 c390 (Link to this contribution) Yes, that is true. We always debate one amendment or new clause, and discuss other things at the sam...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c390 (Link to this contribution) I accept that, Mr. Deputy Speaker. This group of amendments is the result of valuable discussions bo...

Speaker | 463 c382 (Link to this contribution) Order. We are considering Lords amendment No. 11 and the motion to disagree thereto. With this, we m...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c382 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House disagrees with the Lords in the said amendment. However, I also beg t...

Speaker | 463 c382 (Link to this contribution) Order. The Minister must move the motion to disagree.

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c382 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move Government amendment (a) in lieu of Lords amendment No. 11.

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c378 (Link to this contribution) I accept what the hon. and learned Gentleman says, but I am not convinced that further delay to the ...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c377-8 (Link to this contribution) With the leave of the House, I shall comment on the assertions made by the hon. and learned Member f...

Lord Garnier | 463 c378 (Link to this contribution) I agree that the gap between 2000 and 2007 cannot be described as a short period, but of course we a...

Lord Garnier | 463 c375-6 (Link to this contribution) I thought so: all young, brave officers say, ““Charge, men, I’m right behind you!”” I hope that all ...

Jeremy Browne | 463 c376-7 (Link to this contribution) It is fair to say that this group of amendments does not go as directly to the heart of the Bill as ...

Julian Lewis | 463 c375 (Link to this contribution) We are right behind you.

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c385 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move Government amendment (a), which amends Lords amendment No. 35 and relates to clause 5(...

Speaker | 463 c385 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to take Lords amendment No. 35 and Government amendment (a) thereto,...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c385 (Link to this contribution) My apologies for the confusion, Mr. Deputy Speaker. In due course, I shall move amendment (a). That...

Speaker | 463 c385 (Link to this contribution) Order. We are debating Lords amendment No. 14. Together with it, we are debating Lords amendment No....

Jeremy Browne | 463 c384 (Link to this contribution) My contribution will be extremely brief, because I wish only to echo some of the sentiments that the...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c384 (Link to this contribution) I shall try to respond to the points that have been made. I am grateful for the relatively warm welc...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c384-5 (Link to this contribution) I will reflect further on the hon. and learned Gentleman’s points. We will certainly try to ensure t...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c382 (Link to this contribution) I believe that I have fulfilled the requirements. Members of another place expressed genuine anxiet...

Lord Garnier | 463 c382-3 (Link to this contribution) The debate is less contentious that those that we have held so far. I am grateful to the Minister fo...

Lord Garnier | 463 c372 (Link to this contribution) I support the Lords amendments. Although I listened carefully to the Minister’s arguments on behalf ...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c372 (Link to this contribution) The hon. and learned Gentleman has spies.

Speaker | 463 c371 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to take Lords amendment No. 23 and the Government motion to disagree...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c371 (Link to this contribution) I beg to move, That this House disagrees with the Lords in the said amendment.

Lord Garnier | 463 c373-5 (Link to this contribution) Is it not interesting that they say such things to people they talk to? I dare say that if I were em...

Lord Garnier | 463 c373 (Link to this contribution) Does the Minister wish to praise the probation service even further?

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c373 (Link to this contribution) Not only to praise it, but to say that the chairman and chief executive look forward very much to th...

John Grogan | 463 c364 (Link to this contribution) Does my hon. Friend not agree that it would be so much better, with the talent that is available, if...

Patrick Hall | 463 c364-5 (Link to this contribution) I agree with much of what my hon. Friend has just said, especially as he is currently in such close ...

David Anderson | 463 c363 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend mentioned resources as well as the power to commission. We must have the financial re...

Patrick Hall | 463 c363-4 (Link to this contribution) That would be helpful. As my hon. Friend the Member for Walthamstow (Mr. Gerrard) said, we would lik...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c365-6 (Link to this contribution) I thank my hon. Friends, and Opposition Members, for the constructive tone of this afternoon’s debat...

Lord Garnier | 463 c366 (Link to this contribution) How long is this period of reflection likely to be?

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c366 (Link to this contribution) The hon. and learned Gentleman will know that if, as I expect, the House rejects the Lords amendment...

Lord Garnier | 463 c360 (Link to this contribution) But is the hon. Gentleman as concerned as I am that that arrangement is not on the face of the Bill?...

Neil Gerrard | 463 c361 (Link to this contribution) That is right. It very much fits in with what was being said last week in the annual report from the...

Jeremy Browne | 463 c361-2 (Link to this contribution) I do not intend to detain the House at great length, but I want to say a few words given that we are...

Neil Gerrard | 463 c360-1 (Link to this contribution) I am coming to that. The letter is significant. It represents real movement from the Government’s po...

Patrick Hall | 463 c361 (Link to this contribution) My hon. Friend is talking about one of my key concerns. What we have heard from the Minister today h...

Lord Garnier | 463 c362 (Link to this contribution) The reality of the previous Prime Minister’s Government was reflected by the fact that in the winter...

Jeremy Browne | 463 c362 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful for that intervention because it further reinforces my point. In essence, the critique...

Jeremy Browne | 463 c362 (Link to this contribution) It is an opportunity to say his name on the Floor of the House. Perhaps the measure is a legacy of ...

Patrick Hall | 463 c363 (Link to this contribution) On Report and Third Reading—perhaps a little late in the day—the Government began to listen, thanks ...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c352-3 (Link to this contribution) That goes to the heart of the amendments, which is why I have focused on it from the outset. I entir...

John Grogan | 463 c353 (Link to this contribution) May I press my right hon. Friend a little further on the proportions of the total probation work tha...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c353-4 (Link to this contribution) I cannot give my hon. Friend any assurances about what will be commissioned at national, regional or...

Lord Garnier | 463 c354 (Link to this contribution) The Minister is in danger of conflating two separate arguments and therefore of misleading himself. ...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c354-5 (Link to this contribution) I am grateful to the hon. and learned Gentleman for ensuring that I do not mislead myself, but let m...

Lord Garnier | 463 c355-6 (Link to this contribution) I agree with the Minister that the Bill was considerably improved in the other place. I agree with t...

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c356 (Link to this contribution) Given what the hon. and learned Gentleman has just said, why would Stephen Bubb of the Association o...

Lord Garnier | 463 c356-9 (Link to this contribution) I shall deal with that question head on. It is not surprising that an organisation such as ACEVO, wh...

Neil Gerrard | 463 c359-60 (Link to this contribution) I want to speak to Lords amendment No. 6, on the key issue of who does the commissioning, and at wha...

Lord Garnier | 463 c373 (Link to this contribution) I have a constituent. In the course of his remarks to the Leicestershire and Rutland probation serv...

Speaker | 463 c390 (Link to this contribution) With this it will be convenient to take Lords amendments Nos. 5 and 15, 16 and Government amendments...

Lord Garnier | 463 c384 (Link to this contribution) I do not want any more bites at the cherry than are necessary. I am not so much fussed about ““so fa...

Lord Garnier | 463 c365 (Link to this contribution) I am sure that what the hon. Gentleman says is right. Indeed, nowadays the courts can read what a Mi...

David Anderson | 463 c362 (Link to this contribution) Who?

Lord Hanson of Flint | 463 c371-2 (Link to this contribution) The Lords amendments apply two novel parliamentary processes to two different aspects of the Bill. F...

Patrick Hall | 463 c365 (Link to this contribution) I am interested in what the hon. and learned Gentleman says, but in practice, how offender managemen...

David Anderson | 463 c352 (Link to this contribution) I wonder whether my right hon. Friend agrees with Lord Falconer, who said about commissioning in his...

Subjects

Conflict of interests

Offenders

Private sector

Public sector

NHS trusts

Probation

Standards

Reoffenders

Basic skills

Community orders

Legislation

Offender Management Bill 2006-07

Contains statistics

Yes

Link

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