Bribery Bill [HL]

And the noble Lord, Lord Williamson. I apologise for leaving his name out; I will not do so again. As the Minister pointed out in his introduction, bribery has been illegal under United Kingdom domestic law for centuries and a process of ad hoc reform has led to a patchwork of offences under the common law, the Public Bodies Corrupt Practices Act 1889, the Prevention of Corruption Act 1906 and the Prevention of Corruption Act 1916. There have been few developments in the law for more than 90 years, aside from the jurisdictions of these offences being extended in 2001 to include acts committed abroad by United Kingdom citizens and companies. I am grateful to the Minister for confirming that we are nevertheless compliant with our international obligations. I note that the noble Lord, Lord Thomas of Gresford, disagreed on that point. No doubt that is something that we can explore at a later stage. The Minister quoted the Law Commission, which recently described the law of bribery as, ""riddled with uncertainty and in need of rationalisation"." We all recognise that, when the Joint Committee was taking evidence in its scrutiny of the draft Bill, all witnesses supported the case for reform, reflecting calls that were first made by the Royal Commission on Standards in Public Life some 30 years ago. Particular criticisms of current law include the use of inconsistent terminology, the artificial divide between public and private sectors and the focus on whether or not an individual is acting as an agent on behalf of a principal, a concept which is both complex and leaves gaps in the law. I understand that few individuals have been prosecuted under the existing bribery legislation in recent years, as I am sure the Minister will be able to confirm in due course, although a number of allegations have been pursued as part of a fraud charge. No company has ever been convicted under the current law aside from Mabey and Johnson, which recently pleaded guilty to making corrupt payments after self-reporting them to the Serious Fraud Office. The fact that this does not reflect the scale of the problem represented by bribery may in part be attributed to the difficulties in gathering evidence in support of a prosecution, as my noble and learned friend Lord Lyell made clear. Briefly, although we are broadly satisfied with this Bill and feel that it is worthy of our support, we will look at the fine detail in Grand Committee, as the Minister and the House would no doubt expect us to do. We have concerns about how the Bill is framed and we will probe, for example how Clause 7 will work in practice. An offence of omission is being created for companies that do not prevent bribery. The defence is vague. We will probe what is meant by "adequate procedures". One of the core aims of this legislation must be that it is clear and unambiguous. We have heard representations from businesses that seek assurances that they are not going to be left in difficulties because of the change in the law. A great deal may hinge on what sort of guidance is put in place, rather than on the wording of the Bill, and we will certainly be looking at putting down amendments to elicit more information from the Government on this. I was therefore interested that so many noble Lords mentioned the need for guidance; the noble Lord, Lord Williamson, and others particularly stressed its importance. The noble Viscount, Lord Colville of Culross, stressed the importance of the timing of that guidance and of ensuring that it is in place before the Bill comes into force. That it is certainly something that we would want to look at in detail. We will also examine carefully, as my noble and learned friend Lord Mackay of Clashfern put it, the safeguards that are in place before a prosecution can be made. There are very differing views on what the role of the Attorney-General, as opposed to the three directors, should be; the view of the noble Lords, Lord Goodhart and Lord Thomas of Gresford, was different from that of my noble and learned friends who are sitting behind me. No doubt, again, we can debate the matter in Grand Committee, where we shall want to look at it carefully. The Minister, my noble and learned friend Lord Mackay of Clashfern and others referred to the report of your Lordships’ Constitution Committee, chaired by my noble friend Lord Goodlad, which is highly critical of Clause 12. Virtually every noble Lord has mentioned Clause 12; I shall not repeat their names. The issues of whether there should be defences for the security services and law enforcement agencies, how wide they should be and whether they will need the consent of a Minister will take up a good deal of our time when we come to deal with them in Committee. A great many other issues will arise. The Minister referred to parliamentary privilege, although others said that that issue might be for another day and another Bill. A question arose about the facilitation of payments. The noble Lord, Lord Goodhart, referred to the problem relating to subsidiary companies and so on and my noble and learned friend Lord Lyell of Markyate referred to the complexity of Clauses 1 to 5 and whether we need to simplify them. We will explore all these matters carefully. Having said that, I think that this is a rare example of a Bill that is destined not to change much during its passage through the House. We will wish to examine its provisions thoroughly and we may have to make changes in that process, but, I repeat, we support the Bill and will do our utmost to ensure that it gets on to the statute book before the general election, whenever that might take place.