Apprenticeships, Skills, Children and Learning Bill

My Lords, I, too, support my noble friend Lord Layard. Indeed, I put my name to these two amendments. I will not repeat everything that has already been said, although I very much agree with much of what the noble Baroness, Lady Sharp, has just said. On Amendment 110, the Minister said that employers would be required to discuss with young people who had completed a level 2 apprenticeship the possibility of moving on to a level 3 apprenticeship. I very much support that proposal, but I do not think that it goes far enough. As my noble friend Lord Layard said, we do not have the opportunity very often to change the law on a subject such as this. When we have such an opportunity, we should grasp it, as we would for young people who are in full-time education. I am particularly concerned about the lack of equity between those who will go down the part-time, work-based learning route and those who will go down the full-time, GCSE to A-levels, A-levels to higher education route. It is grotesquely unfair to give that latter group of young people an entitlement but not to allow it for this group of young people, particularly as many of them will come from much less privileged backgrounds where they do not have the kind of support that the other category of young people can expect from their families and from other people in their neighbourhoods and communities. We will lose an enormously important opportunity if we do not have an entitlement in the Bill. As my noble friend said, if we were going to implement this legislation tomorrow, or even next year or the year after, I would understand the reluctance of my colleagues in the Government to accept this amendment, but we have six years to plan for it. I believe passionately that we should accept it and in doing so make a future for many young people which they currently do not have. Our economy needs it, so it is a matter not just of social justice but of having more highly trained young people. Whatever benefits we will get from larger numbers of 16 to 19 year-olds doing a level 2 apprenticeship we will be able to multiply many times over if we assume that those who do this successfully can go on to the next stage. I am sure that no one in this House would believe that a level 2 apprenticeship will be enough to take us to the next stage of a highly trained, highly skilled workforce for the sort of economy we will see as the 21st century develops. I very much hope that the Minister will take this back and think again about it. We have an enormous budget in Train to Gain and there might be an opportunity to shift some of those resources into something for those 19 to 25 year-olds or 19 to 22 year-olds—whatever cut-off date we make—who want to take their education and training to the next stage. Behind my commitment to Amendment 125 lies a genuine concern that we will not get enough apprenticeship places. We are starting from a very low base. There has to be a strong and powerful incentive to employers to get engaged with the provision of apprenticeships. I have talked to quite a number of employers in the public and private sectors, and they are worried about what this means for them in terms of resources. We will have to hold out a rather bigger and more obviously accessible carrot than we are at the moment. I accept that the details of this may need a little more work, but it seems a reasonable requirement that the head of the National Apprenticeship Service should put forward a totally comprehensible scheme which is not too bureaucratic and is easily accessible for employers who wish to engage in apprenticeships. They are a little nervous and concerned about what it will mean for their firms and organisations, in the public as well as the private sector, if they go down this route. They are concerned that there may be very little to compensate them for the extra time that it takes to look after these young employees and give them the training that they deserve. I, too, join others in thanking the Government for changing the nomenclature. Terminology is important and the word "offer" is a much better term than scheme. I very much welcome what the Minister has said about improving access to apprenticeships for disabled young people. They have a huge amount to give and we should do everything we can to make it easier for them to get the training that they want and deserve. I give my grateful thanks to the Government for moving in that respect.