Northern Ireland Arms Decommissioning Act 1997 (Amnesty Period) Order 2009

My Lords, I cannot express more articulately or lucidly than the noble and right reverend Lord, Lord Eames, how much I want to see loyalist paramilitaries decommission. I pay tribute to the decommissioning commission. I should perhaps point out that, many years ago, when I was a Member in another place, we began by calling it ““disarmament””, so let us not forget what we are talking about. We are talking about guns and explosives that can make people’s lives a misery and support criminality and the drug barons as well as operating under the disguise of loyalism. Ten years ago, we had an agreement in Northern Ireland; 10 years ago, we believed that we were bringing to an end the trauma and tragedy of 30 years. I agree with others who have spoken tonight and my party will certainly concur with the Lord President’s proposal—we have no intention of making things difficult—but she is the one who talked about devolution of policing and justice. One of the difficulties that I and the people in Northern Ireland have is that we do not hear the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. If we are going to appeal to those people on the loyalist side who have guns and explosives to disarm, we must from these Benches and the Benches in another place be a great deal more open with the people in Northern Ireland. I have sought information—I give this as an example—as to whether the explosives, the Semtex, used by dissident republicans was obtained from the residue of the Provisional IRA’s armoury. To some extent, I blame the Chief Constable. He and the Secretary of State are probably conniving to ensure that I do not get an answer on that. If we could get an answer on such things, and if we could be told what the reality is on the ground, we would have a bigger stick, bluntly speaking, to beat loyalists over the head, to tell them to get on and disarm as far as their weaponry is concerned. We talk about devolution of policing and justice when we know that in Northern Ireland the most dreadful deals are being done. I give an example. A young Lithuanian boy was deliberately murdered by another Lithuanian, our Director of Public Prosecutions accepts a plea of manslaughter, and that murderer is sentenced to four years. If we expect loyalist paramilitaries and other paramilitaries to raise their game to adopt an ethos and a practice, then we should not be lowering our standards as they are being lowered. I conclude by putting this question to the noble Baroness. I am grateful to her because she has always been frank with me. Are we watering down the standards of law and justice in Northern Ireland in order to pander to the lowest common denominator? If so, I have to say that we will not succeed. We will not build on 10 years of hard work to implement the Belfast agreement. I leave her with that thought and hope that she will be able to give me an answer as to why the reality and the truth of what is happening in Northern Ireland is cloaked from us in this place and in the other place.