Human Fertilisation and Embryology Bill [Lords]

I am asking my hon. Friend to think about being involved in the consultation, participating in the public debate and improving the draft regulations if and when they come forward. He should then fully participate in an affirmative resolution debate in the House before the regulations are passed. I am asking hon. Members to think—and that is a reasonable thing to do. Amendment No. 49 seeks to limit the regulating power so that only embryos or eggs that have been subjected to processes to prevent the transmission of mitochondrial diseases through cytoplasm could be permitted for use in the treatment. I absolutely understand and appreciate the intention behind it. I have to say, however, that the amendment is ambiguous—a point that has been touched on in the debate. Everything in a cell could be considered to be cytoplasm, including the mitochondria and the nucleus, and restricting regulating powers to prevent the transmission of serious mitochondrial diseases via the cytoplasm would not necessarily achieve the aim of excluding transmission via the cell's nucleus. For that reason, there was no need to put the amendment before the House. There are other more appropriate ways in which mitochondrial disease transmitted via a cell's nucleus could be treated. We are looking specifically, through pre-implantation, at genetic diagnosis of the embryo. On that basis, I hope that the hon. Member for Southport (Dr. Pugh) will accept that we are attempting to strike the right balance, while leaving open the final decisions until the information is available and this House has taken a final view, following consultation. Amendment No. 73 would prevent any research from being undertaken in the UK the purpose of which is to develop techniques of germ-line genetic modification. It would have the effect of prohibiting research projects from being licensed by the Human Fertilisation and Embryology Authority where the purpose of the research was to develop techniques for the genetic modification of human embryos. In addition, the amendment would restrict the regulation-making power to prevent the research. We are not aware of any researcher who would want to undertake such research, particularly in the light of the international agreements in place to prevent such activities from being applied for reproductive purposes. The Bill clearly sets out a prohibition on the reproductive application of such practices, and any research licensed by the HFEA would also need to satisfy the criteria that the use of embryos was necessary for the research, and that the research was necessary or desirable. Amendment No. 50 and new clause 24 would introduce a regulating power that requires the Secretary of State to make it an offence to place human gametes in an animal. The Bill does not change the legal position achieved by the 1990 Act, which made no prohibition on the artificial insemination of an animal with human sperm. Such a prohibition was believed unnecessary at the time because of the inability for humans and animals to produce offspring successfully. Equally, the 1990 Act legislated on the creation of human embryos in vitro and on reproductive services. The subject matter was very different from that of the artificial insemination of animals. Since 1990, our knowledge of the ability of humans and animals to procreate has not changed, and there is still no published evidence to suggest that any insemination of an animal with human sperm, whether as part of a scientific study or not, has resulted in pregnancy. Members touched on the regulations that exist and support the legislation in the Animals (Scientific Procedures) Act 1986. The Government believe that the combination of the existing legislation in this area is sufficient, and we are not aware of any developments that require revision of that position. Amendments Nos. 51 and 52 relate to the regulation-making powers in the Bill to extend and alter its definition of embryo, eggs, sperm, gametes and human admixed embryos. They provide that those powers can be used by the Secretary of State only on condition that they are necessary and desirable. It is important that hon. Members understand exactly how that would interact with the rest of the Bill. Amendment No. 47 has been substantially debated this afternoon with regard to a definition of human admixed embryos that include a catch-all category. That category refers to an embryo containing both human and animal DNA in which the DNA of the animal does not predominate. In other words, those embryos are more human than animal. I touched on the conditions under which a licence would have to be sought in an earlier intervention. Amendment No. 47 refers to embryos containing human and animal cells created by a process of tetraploid complementation. In the type of embryo created by the process to which the amendment refers, the cells of an early animal embryo are altered, so that they contain twice the usual complement of DNA. Such cells are destined to give rise to only extra-embryonic tissue. When placed with those altered animal cells, human cells would give rise to the embryo proper, because the animal cells are capable of forming only extra-embryonic cells. The implantation of the embryo created in that way is therefore prohibited by the Bill. Amendment No. 47 seeks to add a further category to the existing categories. Hon. Members have talked about their fear of a loophole that needs to be closed. In looking at the range of issues that have been raised, the Government believe that the embryo created by the process that I have described should be considered as a human admixed embryo, which is regulated under the definition in proposed new section 4A(6)(e) of the 1990 Act, so there is no loophole. In conclusion, let me return to the point about cloning. The Government are absolutely clear that we are committed to banning human reproductive cloning, and the Bill continues to provide for that.