Housing and Regeneration Bill

It is always good to start on a literary note. I have read Lynsey Hanley’s book but I was not convinced by the entire argument. She was very harsh on some of our present estates but community spirit flourishes even in poor and unpromising circumstances. However, it was an interesting account of what has happened and is relevant to much of what we are about in bringing to life the Homes and Communities Agency and the regulator. The HCA is there to enable us to create better places for people to live by bringing together all the agencies in a positive and quality-conscious way—thanks, not least, to my noble friend Lord Howarth—and to give tenants a better deal. If Lynsey Hanley was sitting in this Committee, I hope she would be encouraged. I am sure that my erudite colleagues behind me have read the book. Perhaps I may start by dealing with the group of amendments relating to the lay inspectors. On Amendment No. 110FA, I am happy to reassure the noble Baroness that lay inspectors are a valuable resource and an excellent way of ensuring that inspections have active tenant involvement and investigate problems from the prospective of the service user. For several reasons, the amendment is not necessary because there is nothing to prevent the inspectors from being involved in inspections under either the current or the proposed systems. The current definition of ““inspector”” in Clause 199 does not exclude them or require them. I take the point that the amendment is to enable us to discuss this issue. As I said when I introduced it, Amendment No. 110R covers a person who is authorised in writing by the Audit Commission where it is the inspector. Any person authorised by the regulator covering social housing, where the commission is not the inspector, would include lay inspectors. The Audit Commission has an excellent record on lay inspection. Tenant inspection advisers have been used by the commission since housing inspections in the local authority sector started in April 2000. The Housing Corporation recruited tenants to help carry out inspections of housing associations prior to the transfer of the HA inspection function to the commission in April 2003. TIAs are used on all housing management inspections, including inspections of housing associations, ALMOs and other housing services with a customer-user focus. Even some inspections of a local authority’s housing strategy service use TIAs to carry out mystery shopping. That tradition will be carried forward and is enabled by the Bill. Turning to the lively debate we have just had on the Audit Commission, perhaps I may respond to the issues raised by noble Lords on the main amendment, Amendment No. 110E. I cannot deny that the Audit Commission is a monopoly but it brings consistency of inspection, great efficiency and expertise. We have allowed for cases where it does not have the expertise needed by giving the regulator a choice under Clause 192. On housing management issues, the Audit Commission has what is needed in this complex and large area of work and I am sure that it will be able to carry out its task superbly well. However, if it feels it does not have the necessary expertise, it is a sufficiently confident enough body to say so and to require the regulator to look elsewhere. The noble Viscount, Lord Eccles, made the point that this was unnecessary because a competent regulator should be trusted to decide. He put this argument because we are dealing in notions of trust and transparency. However, it is worth repeating that we are trying to avoid a proliferation of inspections. As I have said, inspections beyond its competence should be and can be declined. We have to have that measure in the Bill for those reasons. On fees and costs, at the moment, the cost of inspection is about £1.8 million. Because we are removing that heavy-handed routine inspection of everyone every five years, those costs will certainly go down. The fee levels will be a matter for the regulator to work out, in consultation. We are requiring the regulator to pay the Audit Commission’s cost, which, as I said, will be lower, but the Audit Commission is itself accountable to the National Audit Office, so there is value for money and accountability built in to the system. I hope that that will reassure the noble Earl, Lord Cathcart. Yes, it is a government body, but it is accountable to the National Audit Office. On the type of inspection applied to charities, the Charity Commission is the statutory consultee on standards, so it will be well represented. In answer to the question of the noble Baroness, inquiries will always be about mismanagement. It will be proper for the Charity Commission to be notified if there are mismanagement concerns about a particular charity. Inspections are likely to be more routine, but we would expect that if the inspection raised a particular concern in relation to a charity, the regulator would let the Charity Commission know of that concern. As a statutory consultee, we think that there will be quite a lot of traffic between them. I hope that I have addressed most of the questions raised by noble Lords. Otherwise, I shall have to write to fill in any blanks. On Question, amendment agreed to. [Amendment No. 110CA not moved.] Clause 194, as amended, agreed to. Clause 195 [Direction by Secretary of State]: