Concessionary Bus Travel Bill [HL]

I thank all noble Lords who have supported the amendment. There is an issue here in how the Government regard their relationship with local government. We are moving from the historical position where free bus fares were a concession given by local authorities, to a national scheme. If we were starting from first principles and the Government were introducing a concession, I have no doubt that the Government would bring in a national scheme and that local authorities would have almost nothing to do with it. But we are at an intermediate point. As a result of this legislation, local authorities will simply be the administrators of a national scheme. They will retain discretionary powers to extend the scheme in certain ways if they wish, and it is right that they should pay the costs when they exercise that power; but in situations such as this where local authorities are required to implement legislation introduced by central Government, central Government should find the means of enabling local authorities to meet the costs. It may not be necessary for the Bill to specify minute details of the financial settlement, but the House should consider whether implementation of the legislation will be properly funded and whether local councils can meet its intentions. There are severe doubts whether that is the case. It is interesting that on such occasions we hear from Ministers arguments about why we should not have a specific ring-fenced grant, and yet local authorities are completely tied up with all kinds of specific grants from all sorts of sources. I wonder why the Government are so resistant in this case when in other instances such grants are usually their first port of call. I would have more respect for the non-specific grant route if the Government had the courage of their convictions and allowed local authorities to spend their money as they wished in every other sense. In fact, local councils would not be in this position if they had more freedom. But they do not, and because they have so little flexibility in their financial dealings, it is difficult for them to manage when a scheme such as this is brought in. The Minister has not answered the question of what will happen if local authorities face a significant funding shortfall for this scheme. On quantum, the Government may allow the right amount, but if you are local authority X and facing a huge shortfall, the fact that local authority Y next door has made money from the scheme is of very little benefit. There has to be a mechanism that links the provision of the grant with expenditure. That is not unreasonable and brings me back to the question of the use of a specific grant. I hope the Minister will give a little more thought to this issue. Simply saying that a DCLG working group will look at the formula grant system and come back in, say, two years’ time with a convoluted formula which may tangentially touch on the question of concessionary fares will not help the local authorities that have to fund the legislation from April. When the noble Lord referred to the problem in Wales, he highlighted the kind of situation we can already see coming down the track. The bill to the National Assembly is increasing not because local councils are doing anything wrong but simply because the scheme is so successful. It has to be funded by someone, either the authorities or government, and we are seeking clarification on who will pay. I shall withdraw the amendment at this stage, but we will have to return to the matter at Third Reading because I do not think that local government will be happy with the responses received today. I beg leave to withdraw the amendment.