Violent Crime Reduction Bill

moved Amendment No. 17: Page 13, line 20, at end insert ““, provided that no charges shall be payable by any persons or clubs unless the local authority is satisfied on the basis of evidence that it is reasonable to impose charges on those particular persons or clubs”” The noble Baroness said: My Lords, I shall speak also to Amendments Nos. 19, 20, 21 and 28. Amendment No. 17 would add a test of reasonableness into the provisions that would empower local authorities to impose extra charges on licensed businesses that fall within an alcohol disorder zone. The drafting in Clause 12 regarding alcohol disorder zones contains a fundamental flaw, as there is nothing in the scheme in its current form to prevent a local authority imposing blanket charges on licensed premises and clubs in an alcohol disorder zone regardless of the degree to which the premises contribute to the disorder. In our view, that is far too arbitrary, and is potentially extremely unfair to those businesses that, for example, close well before the usual times when alcohol-fuelled disorder may take place. The amendment we propose would impose a requirement on the local authority that it must be satisfied it is reasonable to impose charges on particular clubs or people. This provides a safeguard for individual businesses that are entirely innocent of contributing to or causing alcohol-related crime. In Committee the Minister objected to this on the basis that we would be placing an undue burden on the local authority. We disagree. Although of course we acknowledge that establishing a causative link between individuals misbehaving due to excessive drink and specific licensed premises might not be straightforward, it is not unduly problematic, and we have sought to reduce the burden on the local authority by setting the test as one of reasonableness. A test is entirely straightforward and sensible. The issue is essentially one of fairness. Why should a corner shop or convenience store that closes at six o’clock in the evening pay for the late-night problems caused by a few irresponsible licence holders? We on these Benches acknowledge that some licensed premises encourage irresponsible drinking; for example, by free-drink promotions and so-called happy hours, and by serving individuals who are already drunk. There are a few—not many, one hopes, and reducing in numbers. It is entirely reasonable that such irresponsible establishments should be penalised. The main concern of the bodies representing the licensed trade is that there should be a link between paying any charge and being responsible for the alcohol-fuelled trouble, and that is what my amendment seeks to address. The Minister’s response to the debate in Committee gave more cause for concern. He stated that he thought it would be, "““reasonable to assume that all premises inside an alcohol disorder zone must be contributing in some way to the problem””.—[Official Report, 26/4/06; col. 232.]" We simply cannot agree to that broad assumption. It means that even those premises that conduct themselves impeccably could be caught by the penalty of a charge, and that would be a disproportionate way for the Government to behave. I noticed that later, on a different day in Committee, the Minister appeared to take a different tack. I tabled an amendment to probe how the Government would expect the boundaries of ADZs to be drawn and clearly identified. In response, the Minister gave an example that looked similar to the one he had given on 26 April, but which could lead to a significant and far more helpful interpretation of the way charges would be imposed. He said: "““We want to see an ADZ drawn very tightly around the area where it is reasonable to assume that the licensed premises within that designated area have a definite and proven link to the levels of crime and disorder within the locality””.—[Official Report, 17/5/06; cols. 299-300.]" If that second reply is the correct interpretation of the Government’s intention in bringing forward these measures, we would certainly be on the same wavelength. The problem is that the Bill does not make that causal link clear in its terminology. I shall move on to what is effectively the second set of amendments in the group; I proposed that I should take this large group together, because, as I said in opening this afternoon, it is one of the areas where significant progress has been made in discussions with the Government over the summer. It was therefore very much the wish of the British Retail Consortium and the Wine and Spirit Trade Association that I should put on record in full our concerns, and then enable the Government to give what we hope may be a satisfactory response. The effect of the remainder of the amendments in this group would be to ensure that the two types of licensed premises set out in Clause 15(6)(a) and (b) would be exempt from any charges imposed by virtue of the clause. The first type would be those premises whose principle use did not involve the sale of alcohol, and the second would be those premises where the availability of alcohol is not the main purpose for which individuals enter them. The Minister gave an assurance in Committee, at col. 236 on 26 April, that the exemptions in Clause 15(6) would be included in regulations. I said that I would consult the British Retail Consortium and the Wine and Spirit Trade Association to see whether that was sufficient to satisfy them. I met them during the Summer Recess. They reported that they remained concerned that the Government had not put clearly on record their intentions regarding, first, exemptions; secondly, how the charges would be applied to businesses of different sizes, hours of opening and management practice; and thirdly, discounts, and whether in any circumstances a business might receive a 100 per cent discount where it had behaved appropriately. Since we debated this matter in Committee, I have also been contacted by the public affairs manager of Boots plc. He states that Boots is very concerned that the decision on ADZs will be left to regulation. He makes the understandable point that companies such as Boots need clarification that they will be exempt. Will the Minister say today whether the Government’s view is that Boots, and companies that operate in a like manner, will be exempt from charges? Like me, noble Lords may be a little surprised that Boots considered that it might come within the rules governing ADZs. But it was pointed out to me that there is some sale of alcoholic beverages as part of gift sets, particularly in the five months running up to Christmas. We are in that period now and I saw such sets on the shelves in my local Boots last week. For the rest of the year Boots does not sell alcohol. Alcohol sales equate to just 0.1 per cent of Boots’s turnover per annum, but it already pays more for licences than purely alcohol-based retailers, such as small off-licences, due to the fact that the cost of the licence is based not on how much alcohol you sell but on the size of the licensed area. As Mr Sheppard, representing Boots, points out, that is taken to be the whole of the Boots store. I understand that Boots has about 400 stores with licences. Obviously, it is important to know whether the Government intend that businesses such as Boots should be caught up in the ADZ charging system. I have covered the matter in detail as I hope that the Minister’s response will be such that we may not need to return to the matter at Third Reading. I await that response with anticipation. I beg to move.