Government of Wales Bill

My Lords, I am grateful to noble Lords who have spoken in this debate, particularly for the support from the two Front Benches and their recognition of the move that we have made in response to their arguments. However, I must insist again that d’Hondt was there as an aid, support and mechanism. It was never a principle for which this Government would die at the stake on these issues. The basis on which we expect to work is that the Assembly should be responsible for creating its own committees and composition by consensus. I am grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady Finlay, for her comments. She will know that we appreciated her contribution that d’Hondt should be only a fallback position. It is an odd concept to say, ““I am so much in favour of a free vote that I will establish in legislation what parties should do””. That is to misunderstand how parties organise themselves in Parliament. I cannot think how such legislation could ever be enforced on a political party, which is why we did not contemplate it. There are enough difficulties about free votes within a legislature without the law seeking to intrude and bring in an element of compulsion. Therefore, I do not accept that. I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Elis-Thomas, for indicating that progress has already been made on the Commission on the basis of representation, and for his understanding that we should bear in mind the need for a fallback position on the composition of committees. I am less enthusiastic about his concept of the independent Member, but I hear what he says about expecting more in Wales: we will just have to ensure that any seats are held by Labour. On Question, Motion agreed to. 5: Clause 29, page 18, line 9, leave out subsections (2) to (9) and insert- ““( ) The standing orders shall include provision for ensuring that in apportioning members to committees and sub-committees regard is had to the balance of political parties represented in the Assembly.”” The Commons disagree to Lords Amendment No. 5, but propose Amendments Nos. 5A, 5B, 5C and 5D in lieu- 5A: Page 18, line 9, leave out from beginning to first ““the”” in line 12 and insert- ““(1A) The provision must secure that the appointments to the places on each committee are (if possible) determined by a resolution of the Assembly- (a) which secures that its membership reflects (so far as is reasonably practicable) the balance of the political groups to which Assembly members belong, and (b) which (if the motion for it is passed on a vote) has no effect unless at least two-thirds of the Assembly members voting support it. (2) The provision must secure that, if the membership of a committee is not so determined- (a) the person appointed to the first place on the committee is an Assembly member belonging to the largest political group, and (b) ”” 5B: Page 18, line 38, after ““of”” insert ““the provision made in compliance with”” 5C: Page 19, line 1, leave out from ““provision”” to ““the”” in line 12 and insert ““must modify the operation of the provision made in compliance with subsections (1A) to (7) with a view to securing that (so far as is reasonably practicable having regard to the total number of places on committees)- (a) every Assembly member who does not belong to a political group is entitled to be a member of at least one committee, and (b) ”” 5D: Page 19, line 16, after ““under”” insert ““the””