Safeguarding Vulnerable Groups Bill [HL]

Before the noble Baroness withdraws her amendment, the Minister referred in the discussion of this group of amendments and in previous amendments to the need to be proportionate, which is quite a subjective test. There also seems to be a difference when there is regular close contact. This may not seem relevant, but in my mind it is. The Soham murders were committed by the caretaker. The caretaker was not in regular contact with those schoolchildren—there was no contact at all—so why is that such a fundamental basis on which decisions on whether or not someone needs to be monitored are made? I simply do not understand that. It is important that we stand back and think about the matter. I will read with care what the Minister said, but we must remember that the people whom we most want to protect are the most vulnerable. I have just referred to an especially vulnerable group—which is renowned for being abused in prison—and it is our responsibility to do whatever we can to protect them. We are in a brilliant position to do that and we have an opportunity to really make a difference. We are talking about deterrents here—I referred to this yesterday—but we have almost become afraid of imposing deterrents. Somehow life has to be all about solutions and being proportionate and caring. We are talking about a very vulnerable group of people who may be in prison because they have started life in a vulnerable position where they have been abused themselves, and who then go into an arena where they should expect to be especially well protected. I will think again, but I will also consult with other Members of the Committee who have spoken during the debate. I urge the Government to think about the sad fact that the kind of people who will perpetrate these heinous crimes are unbelievably smart; they are very clever and very canny. If they are able to behave in a way that we all find so utterly distasteful and get away with it because they are in a position such as that of a caretaker or someone who is removed from regular contact, we need to rethink some aspects of the Bill.